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My take on the NY Mets

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Postby quicksilver8 » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:27 pm

The Mets have the makings of a solid team that could compete for the NL East title. But everything has to go right for them. Pedro must stay healthy. They must sign Delgado. Piazza must stay healthy. Reyes must stay healthy. Glavine must pitch the way he did last year, not like he did the year before. Lastly, their sucky bullpen has to get a lot better. I don't see all of those factors coming together in some cosmic occurrence, but I do like many of the Met players to be fantasy comebacks as suggested...
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Postby DK » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:33 pm

CubsFan7724 wrote:
DK wrote:
CubsFan7724 wrote:You cant seriously think Pedro is the best pitched in baseball now, do you? Theres a man in Minnesota named Johan Santana that blows Pedros current numbers out of the water and is much younger, too.

Yeah... in 2004. Pedro is better in every other year. Johan needs to show it to me more than one year before I can say he's the best.

Johan had a great 2004. Pedro had a good 2004, a great 2003, a dominant 2002, an injury-plagued but dominant while in 2001, and by far the best pitcher's year ever in 2000.

acapulco wrote:I'm not so optimistic about Pedro. He gave up more hrs last season than the previous 3 combined. His ERA on 5 or more days rest was vintage Pedro. On the usual amount of rest, it was well over 4.00 He may be pitching in a pitcher's park next year, but so is the opposing pitcher. I don't see Pedro winning the 16 games he did this year.

Pedro's moving from a big HR park in the AL in one of the toughest divisions to the best pitcher's HR park in the NL in one of the weakest divisions. It's not anything to worry about.
Notice how I said now, by meaning 05, not 03, 02, 01 whatever. He isn't the best pitcher in baseball anymore by any means. If you think that, then you are lying to yourself.

I am so tired of this argument. It's beating a dead horse. You want my thoughts? Go here:

My thoughts are on maybe the fifth page through the end.
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Postby lesgrant » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:38 pm

With respects to the original post, I agree with most of its optimism.

However, a couple of red flags jump out.

Jose Reyes & Cliff Floyd – neither can seem to stay healthy. Reyes, when he’s in the lineup is very productive and would be a fantasy stud but he can’t even come close to being dependable. If there’s ever a ‘wake me up when…’ player, Jose is it. Cliff was dependable - before he played with the Mets. If I had to guess, I’d say he’s detoxing from ‘roids and I can’t, as an fantasy owner, bank on him. I don’t think I could bank on him as a fan either.

Matsui - The reason why Japanese positional players struggle in MLB initially is because playing in Japan is somewhere between AAA and small market MLB teams. Ichiro and Hideki didn’t struggle because they are HOF players in Japan, the cream of the crop. Guys who are above average over there tend to be marginal over here. When Kaz showed up, he struggled defensively. It was clear that the game was moving too fast for him and he was merely a good prospect. I guess due to financial committmets, egos, and injury (Reyes) problems, they had to start him at the big league level. He should have spent some time in AAA. He still could benefit from some time there.

Aside from those spots, and maybe some soft middle relief, Mets fans should feel pretty good about things. While Delgado is not a foregone conclusion, it’s looking whole lot better that it did a week ago. Although, I can understand how Braves’ fans would say ‘wake me up when…’.

But, I’m really getting sick of this ‘so and so is overpriced’ jazz. In general, it’s another form of bashing that is thrown out to detract from an otherwise excellent acquisitions for NY teams. I have yet to see a marquis free agent signed at bargain basement prices. And guess what, everyone in this city gets paid more money to do the same job. That’s the nature of our economy.

So to expect that any team would acquire Pedro or Beltran for less than what the Mets paid is unrealistic and unfair. In fact, a lot of these knocks come from predictable sources. Not even the Yankees, having won 100 plus games back to back to back, could lure someone away from their present team for less money than that team offered. Pedro wasn’t leaving Boston for any less and Beltran isn’t leaving Houston for any less. Minaya does understand that you need to CLOSE deals, not haggle over a couple of million here or a year there, only to let someone else swoop in and steal it from under his nose. Just because the botched A-rod deal didn’t hurt the Sox last year, doesn’t mean they won’t pay over the rest of A-rod’s contract term.

Lastly, can we put this Vaughn/Alomar/Burnitz stuff to rest? I say so, not because the Mets have new management (Wilpon still signs the checks and Minaya has only a window of generosity), but because none of you, and I MEAN NONE of you, had crap to say about those deals when they went down. It’s ancient history, none of those players are still in NY, so let it go. To bring it up at this point is as cheap as it comes.
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Postby Music2004Man » Sun Jan 09, 2005 7:58 pm

I understand how people are skeptical about Reyes but he's only been in the majors for two years. He's had a bad hammy which is sometimes really hard to come back from and can take awhile to be completely healthy. There have been a couple of people saying that he's hitting over 300 in winter ball and feeling completely healthy. I say he has a good chance to succeed next year and with the large gaps in Shea he could have a good chance to leg out some gappers. Having Beltran hitting behind him should definitely help his value.
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