Page 4 of 6

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:06 pm
by Nomar4prez
XTSilver wrote:If the Sox could have had OCab who already is a fit in their clubhouse for 8 mil less than renteria why didn't they just sign him?


Renteria is much better offensively, and should just as easily fit into the clubhouse.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:14 pm
by StlSluggers
I am so unbelievably disappointed by this.

:,-(

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:17 pm
by trevisc
StlSluggers wrote:I am so unbelievably disappointed by this.

:,-(


me too!

Good move

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:25 pm
by kcbrett5
I think it is a great move by the defending champs. Renteria is a top SS. Defense is very good and offensively will do his part. He is solid and not just a scape piece to the puzzle. try and trade Ramirez (H) and maybe Youkilis. If you can't trade Ramirez, Put him at 2nd for a yr at AAA and he'd be ready for 2006. But one way or the other The sox need a legit #2.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:49 pm
by SaintsOfTheDiamond
I'm not sure about the latter, but I'll argue with you on the first part. Using my feeble analytical skills this is how I see it. (Comparing Renteria to Cabrera):

Take a look at Cabrera's splits MON/BOS last year. I know it's a small sample size, but if you extrapolate his numbers with the better Boston lineup around him to 162 games (~600 AB's) he hit much better than his career averages in MON.

(w/BOS, for 162 games (Renteria's average last 3 years))

R: 33 --> 87 (86)
HR: 6 --> 16 (11)
RBI: 31 --> 82 (85)
H: 67 --> 178 (176)
AVG: .294 --> 178/600 = .297 -(176/573 = .308 (But that was affected disproportionatly by .330 in '03 IMO))

I guess I said all that just to say that if Cabrera's increase with Boston was due to the lineup (which it was IMO), he is comprable to Renteria in every facet offensively -- including AVG his major knock -- not just power. While I would much rather have Renteria, he's not the offensive stud that I think everyone makes him out to be, especially if Cabrera would come $2-$3million/year cheaper. Maybe I'm just in denial or something, but I don't think Cabrera is that much of a step down for either of these two offenses, at least not a $2-$3million difference. :-? I'm sure someone will let me know if I'm wrong on this. :-/

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:27 pm
by slomo007
SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:I'm not sure about the latter, but I'll argue with you on the first part. Using my feeble analytical skills this is how I see it. (Comparing Renteria to Cabrera):

Take a look at Cabrera's splits MON/BOS last year. I know it's a small sample size, but if you extrapolate his numbers with the better Boston lineup around him to 162 games (~600 AB's) he hit much better than his career averages in MON.

(w/BOS, for 162 games (Renteria's average last 3 years))

R: 33 --> 87 (86)
HR: 6 --> 16 (11)
RBI: 31 --> 82 (85)
H: 67 --> 178 (176)
AVG: .294 --> 178/600 = .297 -(176/573 = .308 (But that was affected disproportionatly by .330 in '03 IMO))

I guess I said all that just to say that if Cabrera's increase with Boston was due to the lineup (which it was IMO), he is comprable to Renteria in every facet offensively -- including AVG his major knock -- not just power. While I would much rather have Renteria, he's not the offensive stud that I think everyone makes him out to be, especially if Cabrera would come $2-$3million/year cheaper. Maybe I'm just in denial or something, but I don't think Cabrera is that much of a step down for either of these two offenses, at least not a $2-$3million difference. :-? I'm sure someone will let me know if I'm wrong on this. :-/


I don't think you're wrong at all. The two players aren't worlds apart. I think it would come down to clubhouse presence to be honest...anyone have anything good/bad to say about either of them off the field? I would assume that no-news, is good-news when it comes to off the field problems (I haven't heard of any).

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:29 pm
by SaintsOfTheDiamond
From what I've heard about him in BOS he was great in the clubhouse, but I'm not really sure how accurate that is. In STL everyone loved Renteria from the fans to the players to managment. :,-(

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:30 pm
by StlSluggers
SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:In STL everyone loved Renteria from the fans to the players to managment. :,-(

I'll second that first part.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:31 pm
by slomo007
SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:From what I've heard about him in BOS he was great in the clubhouse, but I'm not really sure how accurate that is. In STL everyone loved Renteria from the fans to the players to managment. :,-(


I wouldn't worry about it then, I'm sure that O-Cab is just happy to be out of Montreal....I doubt he cares if he's playing for Boston or St. Louis.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:37 pm
by Cooner
sorry to change the subject a bit, but what's the fantasy outlook on this... Renteria slumped a little last year, in an offense that was almost as powerful as the BoSox. He bounced around a lot in the lineup (right?) hitting 2nd and 6th IIRC. Would he bat 5th in Boston? And if so, how should his numbers be affected? Thanks for your thoughts...