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Should leagues count holds?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:06 pm
by ny69mets86
Should leagues count holds as a stat? My dynasty league currently does with them at 6 pts per. Wins are 10, losses -8, and saves 10.

However, there is a movement to eliminate holds all together. People say they're too unperdictable, guys can get holds and still get bombed in the game, and there hasn't been one trade in my league all year where someone was trading for holds. Basically, it seems like a wasted stat and the roster positions could be used other ways.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:10 pm
by SaintsOfTheDiamond
I think they're like saves in a way. There is no way to really predict the ones who will rack them up. I wouldn't count either, holds or saves, really since they don't truly gauge a RP's effectiveness IMO. Didn't really answer the question, just my $.02. :-D

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:11 pm
by DaQ
Keep the holds.

Setup guys like K-Rod and Tom Gordon become more important. Usually, the same MR's are near the top. Strikeouts, IP and ERA are all important, and your MR's, if good, really boost you in those categories. They also appear a ton of times, so they can keep producing good numbers.

If you know a bunch of quality MR's, you will do very well. ;-D

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:15 pm
by SaintsOfTheDiamond
I was thinking more from a real life perspective. :-D I guess it's just as easy to play the holds game as it is the saves game in most leagues, so it's kinda like free points in a way. :-?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:33 pm
by Tavish
SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:I think they're like saves in a way. There is no way to really predict the ones who will rack them up. I wouldn't count either, holds or saves, really since they don't truly gauge a RP's effectiveness IMO. Didn't really answer the question, just my $.02. :-D


Couldnt agree with you more. I have pretty well made my opinion about saves known in previous threads, holds is even more annoying. Plenty of other ways to give MR better value (which they deserve).

re

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:50 pm
by ny69mets86
"Other ways," such as?

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:09 pm
by Tavish
Getting rid of the saves category would be a good start to making closers and MR on more equal ground. I tend to like rate stats more than gross numbers, using more of those would bring the value of all pitchers ( SP, MR, CL) closer together.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:09 pm
by matmat
i'd like to see holds+saves as a category, or perhaps inherited runners scored.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:51 pm
by thetongueofire
in one of my leagues this year where we wanted to make it more "realistic", we did that. but it was pretty quick and crude as was everything else. no one regarded in the league as anything important tho... it was more of an "experimental" thing. we just made a cat called (SV + .75 HLD) and weighted it twice. im sure there are MUCH better ways to do it tho.

we also used more ratios as cats and a life like 1460 IP limit. we didnt count Wins or losses that kinda crap but rather SNW's. we also tried SB-.7xCS as a cat... and we had a lot of cats, so it wasnt as big of an issue as it usually is in more "normal" 5x5 leagues.

as for wins, it'd be awesome if someone could figure out a way to "estimate" your fantasy team's offensive production and adjust your pitching staffs wins according to that. but thats kinda taking it too far with my current knowledge.....ok im gonna stop talking now. go on with the thread. :-b

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2004 9:37 pm
by Rico The Retard
holds is an annoying stat i had to waste a starting pitcher just to get gordon grrrrrrrr