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Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

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Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby bobellis75 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 10:28 am

So I have Stephen Strasburg and have been disappointed...dynasty league in the Scoresheet format - if you're not familiar with Scoresheet - it's a little different from standard leagues...anyway....

I had an offer built around Julio Urias and Alex Guerrero offered to me...it would include another starting pitcher like Samardzjia (or someone in that range) and probably a high draft pick for next year as well....

Urias I have no issues with...he's a stud. I worry about selling low on Strasburg and buying high on Guerrero though...I feel like Guerrero will become a man without a position when Puig returns.



Also - a second offer kind of spawned out of my asking another owner what he'd want for Derek Norris...he asked if I'd move Stras and offered Tyson Ross, Norris, and a first round pick next year. He also said he would "sweeten the deal" if we decided to keep talking...so I'm not sure what else I could get out of this guy...maybe a different pitcher than Tyson (like a Zimmerman perhaps) or another bat, etc.

Do either of these sound like a good jumping off point for trade talks? One sound like a better starting point than the other? Just curious to get some other opinions...I'm really struggling with whether I should continue exploring options or just call the whole deal off and not waste my time (or the other guys time).

EDIT: I should clarify - this is an NL Only league too...we do have a handful of crossover guys but 99% of the league is NL guys. (If an NL guy gets traded or signs with an AL team...we have the ability to keep up to 2 of these guys per roster going into the new season...so in a 10 team league..max of 20 AL guys in the league to start the year, basically. I have Adrian Beltre for example). Just putting this out there to give you an idea of the league setup. Thanks again!
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby SecretAgentMan » Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:46 am

It would be selling low on Strasburg. Not a fan of the first deal. Don't like Samrz. Simply not enough for a top pitcher in Strasburg's class (assuming he is healthy).

Jordan Zimmerman, a first pick (assuming it has any real value in a league like this) and Norris would not be a bad return though for Strasburg at this point as Zimmerman is elite in his own right and I usually prefer getting ML talent and not a bunch of minor leaguers that may never do squat. I probably would want to get someone other than a C though for the long haul. Cs come and go and they generally can't be trusted year to year.
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby bobellis75 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:06 pm

SecretAgentMan wrote:It would be selling low on Strasburg. Not a fan of the first deal. Don't like Samrz. Simply not enough for a top pitcher in Strasburg's class (assuming he is healthy).

Jordan Zimmerman, a first pick (assuming it has any real value in a league like this) and Norris would not be a bad return though for Strasburg at this point as Zimmerman is elite in his own right and I usually prefer getting ML talent and not a bunch of minor leaguers that may never do squat. I probably would want to get someone other than a C though for the long haul. Cs come and go and they generally can't be trusted year to year.



Thanks...I was thinking the same on the second deal...it all spawned from me asking about Norris, but I told the guy, Norris doesn't need to be involved in a Strasburg deal (as I'd want to maximize the value I get in return).

As for the first deal...I do really like Urias.

Anyway...neither of those deals are really "firm" offers...just kind of jumping off points, I guess.

If I could get Zimmerman and a first round pick plus a good bat...that's not a bad haul though.
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby METS 24 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 1:03 pm

Am I missing something here? You are getting Julio Urias, Alex Guerrero, Jeff Samardzija, & a high draft pick for just Stephen Strasburg? How are you not jumping on this? Post your roster if you can. I have never been in a dynasty league but the thought of having Urias & Guerrero to keep sounds good to me. Strasburg is great but there are a group of pitchers who are just under his tier who are pitching better with no injury history who are under the radar because they have way less hype to their name.

Thanks for the help with mine!!
C-M.Garver
1B-M.Cabrera
2B-H.Alberto
3B-C.Moran
SS-X.Bogaerts
MI-C.Correa
CI-N.Lowe
OF-M.Trout/J.D.Martinez/T.Pham/A.Frazier/C.Frazier
UT-N.Cruz
SP-G.Cole/H.Ryu/M.Clevinger/J.Berrios/M.Tanaka
RP-F.Vazquez/S.Greene/A.Colome/C.Martinez
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby bobellis75 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 1:19 pm

METS 24 wrote:Am I missing something here? You are getting Julio Urias, Alex Guerrero, Jeff Samardzija, & a high draft pick for just Stephen Strasburg? How are you not jumping on this? Post your roster if you can. I have never been in a dynasty league but the thought of having Urias & Guerrero to keep sounds good to me. Strasburg is great but there are a group of pitchers who are just under his tier who are pitching better with no injury history who are under the radar because they have way less hype to their name.

Thanks for the help with mine!!


As requested....and like I said, this is Scoresheet which is a little different...it's a simulation game based on each week's stats, etc. (Which is why I don't really have a closer, as you can plug in anyone at closer in a simulation). Anyway.....here it is (Ignore those numbers, they are just player ID numbers but I just copied and pasted from the site).

Right now Stras being hurt is killing my rotation though...I had dreams of a 1 thru 3 of Greinke, Stras, Cueto...Liriano has been great as a 3 though. But my depth in guys like Kennedy, Hudson, Garza has been garbage. So I could use a solid starter to plug in and stay afloat this year. Even though it's a dynasty...I hate losing :) and I'm not in a rebuild or play for next year mode.

1 R Cueto,Jo
7 R Strasburg,St
15 R Greinke,Za
16 R Kennedy,Ia
26 R Hudson,Ti
39 R Garza,Ma
40 L Liriano,Fr
89 L Cingrani,To
95 R Bolsinger,Mi
104 R Morrow,Br
177 R Lee,Za
190 R Syndergaar,No
205 R Glasnow,Ty
218 R Wisler,Ma
223 R Blackburn,Cl
234 L Nicolino,Ju
241 R Shipley,Br

275 R Reed,Ad
282 R Romo,Se
294 R Benoit,Jo
296 R Grilli,Ja
298 L Torres,Al


386 R Ruiz,Ca
395 R Ramos,Wi


444 L Adams,Ma
446 R Morse,Mi
450 L Votto,Jo

467 R Kendrick,Ho
471 R Prado,Ma
501 L Peterson,Ja

1488 R Beltre,Ad

1520 R Andrus,El
557 R Escobar,Yu

611 R Pence,Hu
613 L Span,De
615 L Granderson,Cu
630 R Braun(Mil),Ry
639 L Jay,Jo
668 R Cuddyer,Mi
724 R Piscotty,St


You can see the potential rotation I will have in a couple of years could be pretty filthy....with Syndergaard, Glasnow, Wisler, Shipley, etc....adding Urias to that would give me a pretty formidable future rotation (assuming even 3 of them turn out like most scouts think)
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby BiGAnT » Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:50 pm

Thanks for your help with mine!

So I agree with the last user - I like that first deal. Urias, Guerrero, Samardzjia and a high first rounder..I would also jump on that. I may be a little biased (had Strasburg last year, wasn't great, and am a Phils fan) BUT I still think that there's something wrong with Strasburg - whether it's mechanical, mental, injury-related, etc. Don't get me wrong, I understand it could be "selling low" down the line, but I don't know how much I would say that. I think the potential talent with the LA guys is huge, and the high first round pick is great alongside a guy who can be solid in Samardzjia (despite some struggles).
And to be completely honest I also like the second deal (especially with Zimmerman if you could make that happen), so I could see working on that one if the first one falls through, or you don't trust Guerrero's playing time going forward. Again, it could be my willingness to jump ship with Strasburg, but this is two seasons in a row where I haven't been very impressed, so that's how I feel about him. I think you could get some very good returns here...
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby bobellis75 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 3:57 pm

BiGAnT wrote:Thanks for your help with mine!

So I agree with the last user - I like that first deal. Urias, Guerrero, Samardzjia and a high first rounder..I would also jump on that. I may be a little biased (had Strasburg last year, wasn't great, and am a Phils fan) BUT I still think that there's something wrong with Strasburg - whether it's mechanical, mental, injury-related, etc. Don't get me wrong, I understand it could be "selling low" down the line, but I don't know how much I would say that. I think the potential talent with the LA guys is huge, and the high first round pick is great alongside a guy who can be solid in Samardzjia (despite some struggles).
And to be completely honest I also like the second deal (especially with Zimmerman if you could make that happen), so I could see working on that one if the first one falls through, or you don't trust Guerrero's playing time going forward. Again, it could be my willingness to jump ship with Strasburg, but this is two seasons in a row where I haven't been very impressed, so that's how I feel about him. I think you could get some very good returns here...



Thanks man...yeah Strasburg has other world stuff but mostly I worry about his durability. I will disagree with your thoughts on him last year...he did lead the NL in K's....with 242 and something like 10 K per 9 innings. So that was great. But that was his first year over 200 IP (yeah I know he had surgery earlier in career he had to come back from) but now he's got another ailment with the neck thing...so who knows what that turns into.

I'm starting to wonder if he's one of those guys who will have a great year here and there to keep you coming back for more...but in between will have injury problems, etc...I dunno...hard to say. He's still just 26. But Urias is 18 and on the verge of the big leagues. Samardzjia isn't great but is a solid middle of the rotation guy. Guerrero's got a great stick but could be a man without a position soon. I think he'll play somewhere...whether it's in LA remains to be seen.
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby BiGAnT » Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:14 pm

bobellis75 wrote:
BiGAnT wrote:Thanks for your help with mine!

So I agree with the last user - I like that first deal. Urias, Guerrero, Samardzjia and a high first rounder..I would also jump on that. I may be a little biased (had Strasburg last year, wasn't great, and am a Phils fan) BUT I still think that there's something wrong with Strasburg - whether it's mechanical, mental, injury-related, etc. Don't get me wrong, I understand it could be "selling low" down the line, but I don't know how much I would say that. I think the potential talent with the LA guys is huge, and the high first round pick is great alongside a guy who can be solid in Samardzjia (despite some struggles).
And to be completely honest I also like the second deal (especially with Zimmerman if you could make that happen), so I could see working on that one if the first one falls through, or you don't trust Guerrero's playing time going forward. Again, it could be my willingness to jump ship with Strasburg, but this is two seasons in a row where I haven't been very impressed, so that's how I feel about him. I think you could get some very good returns here...



Thanks man...yeah Strasburg has other world stuff but mostly I worry about his durability. I will disagree with your thoughts on him last year...he did lead the NL in K's....with 242 and something like 10 K per 9 innings. So that was great. But that was his first year over 200 IP (yeah I know he had surgery earlier in career he had to come back from) but now he's got another ailment with the neck thing...so who knows what that turns into.

I'm starting to wonder if he's one of those guys who will have a great year here and there to keep you coming back for more...but in between will have injury problems, etc...I dunno...hard to say. He's still just 26. But Urias is 18 and on the verge of the big leagues. Samardzjia isn't great but is a solid middle of the rotation guy. Guerrero's got a great stick but could be a man without a position soon. I think he'll play somewhere...whether it's in LA remains to be seen.



Ok I totally didn't realize/remember his stats were actually that good last year (again, probably the Philly bias - maybe I didn't want to admit it? haha I also lost in the playoffs cuz I believe he had a bad outing or two during my matchup, but yeah I was definitely wrong there haha)

That being said, I think Guerrero will force his way into a conversation somewhere like you said so I wouldn't worry about that too much. And yes, Samardzjia would just be a solid throw-in, nothing special. So let me ask, what's the true value of that high first round draft pick?? Because that seems like a big piece to me, no?
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby bobellis75 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:35 pm

It CAN be a good value....we can keep up to 13 big leaguers per team...although some guys will trade the protected slots for other things like picks or a player, etc (teams who don't have much to build on at the big league level). We can keep unlimited minor leaguers...but they count against draft picks from the back end of the preseason draft. So look at it like this...the preseason draft is 35 rounds, with the first 13 rounds being keepers. So round 1 is really round 14. BUT...you can get the big time crossover players in that first round....so a guy who signs internationally (like Tomas for example) or a guy who signs in the NL from the AL or is traded to the AL (so this year the young guns on the hitting side were Tomas and Wil Myers...then you had Lester available as well since he signed with the Cubs).

So....you can get some pretty killer players with that pick. I personally usually try to protect 5 SP and then a guy at each position (8 more keepers) for a total of 13. Since it's a sim league...it takes defense into account as well...so you have to keep like a true center fielder (if you can) and so on. Like I have Span for CF. Then I have Braun and Pence in the corners. And so on.

SOrry to ramble...it's just a little complex as compared to a standard league...but in trade value for players...the idea is basically the same. A good player is a good player whether it's regular fantasy or a Scoresheet league like this one. I'm hoping Guerrero will qualify at third soon since Beltre is on the DL....but I can still play him out of position (with a defensive penalty) as he qualifies at 2B from the preseason...he's a qualifier at 2B and OF right now. One game away from earning a legit 3B range in the game. Anyway...rambling again!
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Re: Strasburg - keeper league - hold or trade?

Postby BiGAnT » Fri Jun 05, 2015 4:43 pm

bobellis75 wrote:It CAN be a good value....we can keep up to 13 big leaguers per team...although some guys will trade the protected slots for other things like picks or a player, etc (teams who don't have much to build on at the big league level). We can keep unlimited minor leaguers...but they count against draft picks from the back end of the preseason draft. So look at it like this...the preseason draft is 35 rounds, with the first 13 rounds being keepers. So round 1 is really round 14. BUT...you can get the big time crossover players in that first round....so a guy who signs internationally (like Tomas for example) or a guy who signs in the NL from the AL or is traded to the AL (so this year the young guns on the hitting side were Tomas and Wil Myers...then you had Lester available as well since he signed with the Cubs).

So....you can get some pretty killer players with that pick. I personally usually try to protect 5 SP and then a guy at each position (8 more keepers) for a total of 13. Since it's a sim league...it takes defense into account as well...so you have to keep like a true center fielder (if you can) and so on. Like I have Span for CF. Then I have Braun and Pence in the corners. And so on.

SOrry to ramble...it's just a little complex as compared to a standard league...but in trade value for players...the idea is basically the same. A good player is a good player whether it's regular fantasy or a Scoresheet league like this one. I'm hoping Guerrero will qualify at third soon since Beltre is on the DL....but I can still play him out of position (with a defensive penalty) as he qualifies at 2B from the preseason...he's a qualifier at 2B and OF right now. One game away from earning a legit 3B range in the game. Anyway...rambling again!


That's pretty cool actually, and no you're not rambling, I could discuss this stuff all day too haha thanks for filling me in! And best of luck with making a decision ;-D
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