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bleach168 wrote:What has Varys actually done for the kingdom? Like Littlefinger, he supported the Mad King, Robert, and now Joffrey. Like Littlefinger, he supported killing Dany and almost kills her with the assassin he sent. He doesn't do anything for Sansa. He just stood by while Ned got destroyed.
Varys does help Tyrion, who is clearly a good guy. Though, Tyrion is on the Lannisters side who are clearly bad guys. So is he helping Tyrion or the Lannisters? The "I do what I do for the kingdom" proclamation can be construed in so many ways that I can't credit it as being good intentioned. For example, Tywin honestly thinks he's doing what is best for the kingdom.
mweir145 wrote:bleach168 wrote:What has Varys actually done for the kingdom? Like Littlefinger, he supported the Mad King, Robert, and now Joffrey. Like Littlefinger, he supported killing Dany and almost kills her with the assassin he sent. He doesn't do anything for Sansa. He just stood by while Ned got destroyed.
Well, for one, he's trying to stop Littlefinger from taking power (which Littlefinger will do if Robb dies and he has Sansa) because he knows what kind of person Littlefinger is and what he'd do with that kind of power. Although, I'm sure it's also because he enjoys foiling his plans. One could actually argue that the killing Dany thing was the right call to make, at least from the perspective of preventing future war and saving innocent lives in Westeros. And he wasn't exactly in much of a position to do much for Ned once Littlefinger/the Lannisters turned against him. Though, he did go down and give him water in the dungeons (in this cool scene from S1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_WQUOHZ6Dg). When asked by Ned who he truly serves then, he responded that he serves the realm because "someone must." Now, he may be in it for himself like nearly everyone else, but I haven't yet seen anything to suggest he was lying there. He did help Tyrion with the defense of King's Landing last year, of course.
bleach168 wrote:I re-watched episode 4. The scene where Varys warns Lady Olenna about Littlefinger is not in the books. Also, the scene where Rose warns Varys about Littlefinger is not in the books. I'm not even sure they suspected Littlefinger was interested in Sansa. Afterall, he's slated to marry Lysa and become lord of the Vale (this was explained on the TV show). Littlefinger can't marry two women at the same time, can he? It's weird that Varys and Lady Olenna seem to forget that fact on the TV show.
Just so there is no misunderstanding, I love the Varys character. I do want to believe in him and commit to him, but this is game of thrones and no one is to be trusted.
bleach168 wrote:I must have missed it, but how does Tywin find out that the Tyrells are planning to marry Loras to Sansa again?
mweir145 wrote:Robb reminded me of his father when he executed Karstark for killing the Lannister children. Pretty intense scene. Rather than being practical and keeping his army intact as everyone around him wanted him to, he decided to enact a death sentence for Karstark's treason. Robb stuck with honor and justice there, but it may cost him any real shot of winning the war without the Frey's help.
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