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Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby bayside » Wed May 08, 2013 1:34 pm

Ender wrote:
bayside wrote:

he is no more of a sell high than any other good pitcher off to a great start, and since he has the stuff and peripherals to back it up more than any of the other "sell highs"... well youd better get a haul for him.

So what is it, really, that you dont like about him?


His inability to throw strikes, bad offenses flail away and get themselves out for him but when he faces a good offense I think he is going to really struggle. He is a good pitcher regardless but the question is, is he a legit ace and my answer is no until I see him play a good offense. I also don't expect the Nats to continue to struggle. Harvey has managed to face teams that were struggling at the time 7 starts in a row. It is just hard for me to judge just how good he is when everything has been so favorable for him so far.

I already addressed this but you conveniently left that part of the quote out. HE IS RARELY GOING TO FACE GOOD OFFENSES so why do you worry so much about that?

the only legimate concern i could see would be if the Mets say he is on a strict innings limit and will get shut down. so far that hasnt been mentioned at all
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby kab21 » Wed May 08, 2013 1:57 pm

bigh0rt wrote:Change is unhittable.
Image


Of course it's unhittable. He threw it to a Marlin. :-D

My concern isn't as much that he has faced struggling offenses but rather what happens when there is a slight flaw in his mechanics. So far he has had his stuff and he is demolishing teams. That won't be true all season. How bad will the blow up be and how long will it last?
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby bigh0rt » Wed May 08, 2013 7:40 pm

These stats don't carry a ton of weight, but still it's fun to note. He’s the 1st pitcher in 100 years to have 125 Ks and less than 25 earned runs over his first 17 starts.
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Re: Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby kab21 » Wed May 08, 2013 8:35 pm

garf112 wrote:
He hasn't had all of his pitches in every game. Fastball was not great in the three starts before this last one. Only pitch that has been lights out each game has been changeup. People seem to want to find flaws with the guy and right now there aren't many. Like I said earlier in the thread, by the time everyone figures out that he is an ace, he will be in the Hall of Fame. He is real. I encourage you all to try to find a way to watch him pitch. You don't truly understand how good he is until you watch major league hitters (and yes he has faced some of them this year) look absolutely foolish.

The stats speak for themselves. Combine the stats with what you see in real life and everything tells you he is real. Over 100 innings in MLB with an ERA well below three. Workhorse build.


I'm not as down on harvey as you think. He's my favorite young pitcher but I'm not putting him in the Verlander, Kershaw or Strasburg tier (yet). of course he hasn't been perfect with all of his pitches but at some point he's going to have a game where the wheels come off. How bad will it be? How many starts will it last? Young pitchers tend to wear down over a long season because they haven't pitched a full season yet. how will this affect his control?

You are greatly exaggerating that he will be in the HOF by the time we come around. I think he will be there next season but i think people would be foolish to think he's already there based on 100IP in the majors.
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby kab21 » Wed May 08, 2013 8:45 pm

My website - The World Is Not That Big
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby Ender » Wed May 08, 2013 10:32 pm

I don't think anyone here is really disparaging Harvey. It is a question of whether he fits into that elite top 10 SP or if he is the next group of 10 or so that is up for debate here. For a pitcher who hasn't even thrown 200 IP in his career calling him a top 20 SP is very high praise, especially on a team where W might be hard to come by.
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby bigh0rt » Thu May 09, 2013 11:24 am

Image

Image

Image

Image

Where's the "I just finished all over my keyboard" emoticon?
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby jorgesca » Fri May 10, 2013 12:17 am

wow props to whoever did those gifs.
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby bigh0rt » Fri May 10, 2013 8:31 am

jorgesca wrote:wow props to whoever did those gifs.

FanGraphs. ;-D
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Re: Matt Harvey: Legit Ace?

Postby OBPlover » Fri May 10, 2013 1:30 pm

I wouldn't put too much weight on this whole "he hasn't faced any tough offenses this year" criticism.

There aren't too many old school cliche's I agree with but one of the exceptions is "Good pitching beats good hitting" which is historically true, studied and backed up with statistics.

I remember reading a study, years ago, that showed good hitters tend to fare equally bad as bad hitters against any elite pitch of whatever time period. If Matt Harvey is on his game, it won't matter much to whom he is facing Donavan Solano or Ryan Braun, he'll get his strikeouts.
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