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Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

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Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

Postby Neato Torpedo » Sun May 31, 2009 8:07 pm

When we have a high waiver priority or even a middle one, we rarely ever use it. We wait for someone to drop Furcal or Soto, but those kinds of players don't get dropped in expert/competitive leagues. We wait for LaPorta or Strasburg, hoping for the next Dwight Gooden or Ryan Braun, but rookies usually suck. At the end of the year, it turns out that no one drops anyone good and we spent most of the year climbing the priority ladder. In doing so, guys like Luke Scott, Pavano, and Cust that hit the waiver are passed over because they're not "worth it", so we stay up until/wake up at 3-5 AM to get first dibs on guys that just cleared waivers.

But even if you have last waiver priority, you have a leg up on the guys that stay up that late or wake up that early. And in not bothering to agonize over whether or not a player is worth it, we can pick the Scotts, Custs, and Pavanos with impunity, and waiver wire trash is usually significantly better than FA trash over the course of a season, especially in competitive leagues where WW gold is incredibly rare.

Thoughts?
Last edited by Neato Torpedo on Sun May 31, 2009 10:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why the waiver position is best in competitive leagues

Postby pangbones » Sun May 31, 2009 9:56 pm

I agree. About 3 or 4 years ago I had the #1 waiver, and I sat on it all year, waiting for that one guy, that never came. In the mean time I let several good players go, because they weren't "#1 worthy". The big player I remember passing up was A Harang. He was dropped and had a very good year. And it still erks me that I didn't pick him up. I burned the #2 waiver on S Baker, early this season, and have been snapping up players from the bottom of the order since!!
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Re: Why the waiver position is best in competitive leagues

Postby bigken117 » Sun May 31, 2009 10:12 pm

I had this problem last season in my 18 tm league, I had the #1 waiver and decided to use it on Cueto when he was added instead of waiting for Kershaw. It allowed me to be less selective with my waiver as the season went on, allowing me to pick up guys like Swisher and Chris Davis (hey, last season...).

I learned my lesson a couple years ago when I waited for Delmon and he never came up, I ended up using it on Hermida.

Anyways I guess my point is to use it when you feel the player can help you now.
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Re: Why the waiver position is best in competitive leagues

Postby B-Chad » Sun May 31, 2009 10:43 pm

If I have a top 3 waiver priority early in the season I tend to be semi selective. By semi-selective I mean I don't necessarily use it on the first guy that could help my team slightly, but the first reasonably high ceiling player that becomes available. For instance, last year I had the number one waiver priority and like bigken used it on Cueto. Sure I could have saved it in the hopes of using it on Kershaw or LaPorta (who didn't get called up obviously) or others, but as this post has pointed out, it's useful to have a late waiver priority that you can use over and over again. I guess my player evaluation when burning a top 3 waiver claim goes something like... is this player plus whatever I can possibly snap up at the bottom of the priority worth more then player "x" who may or may not be called up today or 2 months from now, and I almost always lean toward the first choice. My exception would be in a deep keeper league where say David Price last year would be claimed for the future, not necessarily that season's production. Interesting post as it expresses my thinking pretty accurately.. all that said if I had the number 1 priority this year I'd be saving it for Strasburg :-L
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Re: Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

Postby walkoffblast » Sun May 31, 2009 11:31 pm

Yahoo changing things up this year made a big difference depending on your league settings. Which is fitting because this debate can easily go either way depending on how your league is setup. In years past everyone with top waiver priority would have just got Wieters probably. Generally speaking though it is definitely true waiver priority is underused.
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Re: Why the waiver position is best in competitive leagues

Postby Bobbleheadrusty » Sun May 31, 2009 11:40 pm

B-Chad wrote:If I have a top 3 waiver priority early in the season I tend to be semi selective. By semi-selective I mean I don't necessarily use it on the first guy that could help my team slightly, but the first reasonably high ceiling player that becomes available. For instance, last year I had the number one waiver priority and like bigken used it on Cueto. Sure I could have saved it in the hopes of using it on Kershaw or LaPorta (who didn't get called up obviously) or others, but as this post has pointed out, it's useful to have a late waiver priority that you can use over and over again. I guess my player evaluation when burning a top 3 waiver claim goes something like... is this player plus whatever I can possibly snap up at the bottom of the priority worth more then player "x" who may or may not be called up today or 2 months from now, and I almost always lean toward the first choice. My exception would be in a deep keeper league where say David Price last year would be claimed for the future, not necessarily that season's production. Interesting post as it expresses my thinking pretty accurately.. all that said if I had the number 1 priority this year I'd be saving it for Strasburg :-L



I had the third spot in my 18 team this season. I used it on a dropped Duncan early in the season, and have since used my bottom spot on Max Ramirez and Barden (subsequently dropped). In a league like mine where minor leaguers are always available for pickup and few players of consequence are dropped it makes no sense to hold out hope that someone does something stupid and drops a legit player. (we also freeze all draftees until next season's league draft).

We've only had 11 waiver picks so far, I had 3, as did another team.

Here are the names
C. Duncan
P. Feliz
Barden
Byrnes
Corpas
Max Ramirez
Byrd
Tatis
Bergensen
Tracy
Rosales
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Re: Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

Postby Ender » Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:04 am

I tend to disagree. Competitive leagues only see marginal players dropped in the first place. You'll never make a major impact with a higher waiver in them. Getting that one huge rookie is where the money is at in those types of leagues, getting a Braun can win your league for you easily.

The big issue is that Yahoo has destroyed the waiver by putting way too many players in the database way too early. That is what has killed the waiver value.
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Re: Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

Postby walkoffblast » Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:11 am

Ender wrote:I tend to disagree. Competitive leagues only see marginal players dropped in the first place. You'll never make a major impact with a higher waiver in them. Getting that one huge rookie is where the money is at in those types of leagues, getting a Braun can win your league for you easily.

The big issue is that Yahoo has destroyed the waiver by putting way too many players in the database way too early. That is what has killed the waiver value.


Yep, they totally destroyed it by giving you the option to choose which way you wanted to do it.
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Re: Why bottom waiver positions are best in competitive leagues

Postby Bobbleheadrusty » Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:24 am

Ender wrote:I tend to disagree. Competitive leagues only see marginal players dropped in the first place. You'll never make a major impact with a higher waiver in them. Getting that one huge rookie is where the money is at in those types of leagues, getting a Braun can win your league for you easily.

The big issue is that Yahoo has destroyed the waiver by putting way too many players in the database way too early. That is what has killed the waiver value.


Yes. How dare they make players people want available. More people are playing in deep/hardcore/single league leagues. So they follow minor leaguers more then in years past. And there is more coverage of those players out there. So now people want to own those players. Why reward someone for getting lucky by have the top waiver when a Wieters or Hanson is added to the pool? Isn't it better for them to be draftable and always available, so someone willing to invest in them early can be rewarded for taking the risk?

Last year I took Jay Bruce (win), Homer Bailey (loss) and Longoria (BIG WIN) in my draft. Why should the guy that camps on the waiver wire get those players if I'm willing to take the hit of having one of them take a spot for months until they come up.
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