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Why Zito is not in a Decline!!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: Why Zito is not in a Decline!!!!!!!!!!!

Postby sinicalypse » Sat Apr 24, 2004 11:56 am

GSes wrote:GSes is to Zito as eftda is to Bonds

so here we go

Reason's why Barry Zito is not in a decline.

Hits given up in Zito's 3 full season's
2001: 184
2002: 182
2003: 186

Opponets Batt AVG
2001: .230
2002: .218
2003: .219

Opponets OBP
2001: .307
2002: .286
2003: .293

Opponets Slugging %
2001: .345
2002: .340
2003: .324

Opponets OPS
2001: .652
2002: .626
2003: .616

# of HR's given up by Zito
2001: 18
2002: 24
2003: 19

Now I realise that Zito's K/BB and K/9 ratio's have gone down each year but the above stats show that while the K's have gone down, and the BB's have stayed about the same, Zito actually held opponets to career lows in a few categories last season and opponets still only hit .219 which is only .1 point higher then they did in his cy season. I would also like to point out that Zito has made 35 starts in all 3 of his full major league season's so he is prooven to be durable. Zito's ERA last season was 3.30 which was still tops in the AL behind only a few guys. The fact is Zito pitched about the same last year as he has his whole and very young career. Zito also had a career high 4 CG's last season. Barry simply had a lot of bad luck and poor run support in 2003 and the general conception is that Barry is in a decline and had an "off" year.

Here is something else to look at and take it for what its worth or not thats up to you. Tim Hudson who is now 28 and from 1999-2002 Hudson's K/9 decreased each year

1999: 8.71
2000: 7.52
2001: 6.93
2002: 5.74

Because of this many believed Hudson to be in a decline and many felt he didn't warrant ace classification any more (just like zito this year)....then what happen in 2003 Hudson jumped up to a 6.08 K/9 ratio and he had arguably the best year of his young career. So my point is Hudson's K/9 ratio now seems to be coming back up and this year everyone agrees Huddy is an ace. This is one of my major arguments every time an antiZito post comes up and that is the kid is only 25 years old. He is not even in his prime yet and his best years are ahead of him. Some of the above stats actually proove that Zito pitched as well as ever if not BETTER last season. He had a lot of bad luck and things didn't go his way. The reason why Mulder wins more then Hudson and Zito is because he can go deeper into games since he walks no one. If Zito can cut his walks down which by the way in 2003 were still about the same as his previous 2 season's but a little higher (2001:80,2002:78,2003:88) imagine what he is capable of.

One last argument. Zito is a fly ball pitcher and the addition of Kotsay means you have a gold glove out there helping you. What I'm hoping to get is to change some oppinions about the misconception that Barry is in a decline. I know that Hootie and a bunch of others are just going to come back with the K/9 and K/BB and the ball into play numbers but come on you have to cut me some slack here Barry is in no way in a decline at 25 years old.


as a service to all of us who dont have the intestinal fortitude necessary to read this post, we can summise it in one sentence: "because he's on my team"
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Re: Why Zito is not in a Decline!!!!!!!!!!!

Postby davus » Sat Apr 24, 2004 12:49 pm

sinicalypse wrote:as a service to all of us who dont have the intestinal fortitude necessary to read this post, we can summise it in one sentence: "because he's on my team"


;-D

:-D
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Postby GSes » Sat Apr 24, 2004 2:21 pm

Pedantic wrote:So much for that "7 or 8" page thread. ;-7 I'm just glad I traded Zito away for Vazquez.


OK Im being misunderstood.

Firsto off, Vaz is better fantasy wise then zito. Thats a great trade.

I think you guys are overreeacting to one game in which he got shelled. Believe what you want, Zito imo, will be a top 15 fantasy pitcher this season.
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Postby GSes » Sat Apr 24, 2004 2:22 pm

Zito is God wrote:I am a huge Zito fan and fantasy wise I would never put him into the top 10 pitchers.

The Zito for Vazques deal was a good one, vazques is better, but I think this thread is more of the "Zito is not overated" rather then "Zito is amazing and is the best pitcher ever". :-D

I personally think that when Zito is on, he is one of the most TALENTED. But I think right now I would go with Mulder over him, and Hudson behind him.


ya, I was trying to proove he is not overrated, I was not saying you should use your first round pick on him. :-D
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Postby LBJackal » Sat Apr 24, 2004 3:31 pm

Well him being over-rated depends on where you rank him. Most people have him in the territory of Oswalt, Wood, Beckett, Mulder, and Hudson, where he does not deserve to be. As I said yesterday, he will put up similar to numbers to Brad Penny, Matt Clement, Carlos Zambrano, Kip Wells, Mark Redman, and CC Sabathia. I'm not saying that to over-compensate for Zito being over-rated, I honestly see those guys putting up very similar numbers to Zito. High 3's ERA, ~1.30 WHIP, 13-15 wins, 130-150 K's.
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Postby Zito is God » Sat Apr 24, 2004 3:31 pm

Whaddaya know, two Zito fans with Zto avatars agreeing on Zito bieng good. Go figuire... :-D
Sean Tracey has my apologies, we all know Ozzie Guillen is an idiot. I'm rooting for you!
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Postby DK » Sat Apr 24, 2004 4:38 pm

I've got a quick question. Zito has an absolutely fabulous curve, and I was wondering if those who have seen Matt Riley (who also apparently has a sick curve) pitch could compare the two. I've seen Zito pitch, but not Riley. Thoughts? Comments? Comparisons?
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