Return to Baseball Leftovers

Fantasy Tools - Depth Charts and Projected Lineups

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Postby baseball genius » Mon Feb 02, 2004 10:27 pm

I love rotochamps.com and use it for all of my projections. Although you have to also combined those projections with your own common knowledge for the game I find the projections accurate and detailed.
Image

Detroit Tigers 2004 World Series Champions
baseball genius
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 404
Joined: 17 Jan 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: on the mound

Postby swingaway » Mon Feb 02, 2004 10:59 pm

I use big leaguers .com, mlb.com, espn.com and the other sites listed in this post.
swingaway
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar
Pick 3 Weekly Winner
Posts: 1618
(Past Year: -20)
Joined: 6 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: at the cafe

Postby HOOTIE » Tue Feb 03, 2004 12:57 am

Those projections look extreme for a 4x4, where saves and sb get overvalued. But it's 5x5 projections. I have no idea how you got those earning figures? Those projections for Arod are similiar to his 01 and 02 seasons where he was a $42-$45 player. You have a tough sell ahead of you. Arod/Pujols not in top 10. Bonds/Manny not in top 50.
Smells Like Teen Spirit
HOOTIE
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicResponse TeamFantasy ExpertCafe Ranker
Posts: 15321
(Past Year: 374)
Joined: 12 Jan 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Pearl Jam country, right next door to Nirvana, Soundgarden, and Alice in Chains.

Postby wrveres » Tue Feb 03, 2004 1:08 am



rototimes is king ... I still haven't seen any site that updates its depthcharts and lineups quicker.
wrveres
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterEagle EyeInnovative MemberCafe Musketeer
Posts: 31204
(Past Year: -313)
Joined: 2 Mar 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby rotochamp1 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 1:24 am

Those projections look extreme for a 4x4, where saves and sb get overvalued. But it's 5x5 projections. I have no idea how you got those earning figures? Those projections for Arod are similiar to his 01 and 02 seasons where he was a $42-$45 player. You have a tough sell ahead of you. Arod/Pujols not in top 10. Bonds/Manny not in top 50.


I disagree about it being a tough sell. Actually it doesn't need to be sold at all, we give it away free. It is there to be used for those who choose to, and for those who don't like the rankings, well you can still use the projected numbers, I assure you those will be hard to argue with. I understand that not everyone is going to agree with how our formula ranks them, all I can tell you is that I use our lists to generate cheat sheets and I always have a competitive team.

It really doesn't matter to me if people disagree with the rankings, I just don't want to see our site getting trashed on other forums without people asking us about our product on our forums. People will be unfairly dissuaded from checking us out based on quick judgements made by a couple of people.
"Nothing about this great game is trivial. There are simply some compelling bits of baseball knowledge that remain rather obscure." - Bob Costas on the meaninglessness of the expression 'baseball trivia'.
rotochamp1
Little League Legend
Little League Legend


Posts: 8
Joined: 2 Feb 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby wrveres » Tue Feb 03, 2004 2:02 am

rotochamp1 wrote:
justinA wrote:
kentx12 wrote:Nice looking site. Thanks for the link.


There overall rankings for a 5x5 roto league have Carlos Beltran ranked #1 overall. :-?

omg.. their projections are horrible.. beltran at #1, AROD at 20!!! behind Carl Crawford!!!! hes at 12.. i hope they are just kidding or something, wow they are awful..ppl say TSN is bad


I am one of the founders of rotochamps.com and while you are free to disagree with our projections, perhaps you should look into WHY we have them ranked the way they are. Do you look around the web to find new perspectives on fantasy baseball, or just to find reinforcement for your own beliefs?

We put a great deal of analysis into the projected stats for each player, and we would be happy to discuss any player who's projected stat line you do not understand. Once those projections are done they are plugged into a computer algorithm to assign a dollar value. This second part of the process has no human interference.

We do not suggest that you draft straight off the order of the list, rather it should be used to identify bargains at the draft table. We would be foolish to suggest you should not draft AROD in the first round because he will not fall lower than that. But we do feel that the final VALUE at seasons end, would look like what you see on the site.

I invite you all to come to our forums and contest any players projection that you do not agree with. Of course we will not be 100% correct once the season plays out, but no one is. But I guarantee that if you take our projections into account at draft day you will walk away with some great bargains.



well just a quick scan of your projections ... I'll use my forum vs yours thanks ...

1B .. Lots of serious issues here .. I'll avoid the obvious Nick Johnson, David Ortiz and Jason Giambi failures ... but you have Phillips at 1st and then follow it up by ranking Huff in the OF? ...
2B ..Mike Young number 2 and Kent number 6 :-? I'd love to hear the arguement on that one, in my forum of course. I'd gamble that it will contradict your Arod ranked # 20 arguement. ;-)
SS .. you have Tejada batting .320 ? :-? ..and yes I went and read your agruement's, I am still giggling at Baltimore bieng a hitters park ;-D
C .. Kendall number one... Javy number two???
Javy wasn't even drafted in 50% of leagues last year. Glad to see you have bit hook line and sinker too
3B .. Hey, Yanks04 This site has Aaron Boone as the best 3B inbaseball in '04... Before his injury of course.. you should come see this. Its kinda funny. :-D

Actually if you look closer you will see that they are really tied, Their dollar value is $31 for each. The computer just lists the tied players in whatever order it wants, no ryhme or reason to it.


actually I think there is no ryme or reason to any of your projections... sorry. I just read the whole projections thread out of respect. And I came away thinking you guys did alot of this by "gut feeling"

GL with your site .... It sure is "Pretty" ... not accurate ... but "Pretty"




just one last shout out here ... Nice to see a "Cafe Member" correcting the Admins of another site. At least I think it is a cafe member. I wonder how many other projections were based upon this "gut" feeling.

Madd Props Matt ;-D

Matt wrote:I need to add another piece of information to the Tejada argument. It was stated that hitting in Baltimore would help Tejada b/c Baltimore is a hitters park. The truth is however, that Baltimore is one of the worst parks in MLB to hit in, SINCE they changed their dimensions in 2002. I think you should read this article about baseball parks, and which ones are and arent favorable.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=gradingtheballparks&prov=tsn&type=lgns

Now I always thought Baltimore was a hitters park, but over the last 2 years (in which they changed their dimensions, it is not a hitters park anymore).
wrveres
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterEagle EyeInnovative MemberCafe Musketeer
Posts: 31204
(Past Year: -313)
Joined: 2 Mar 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby wrveres » Tue Feb 03, 2004 2:29 am

My personal favorite in these Rotochamps projections ..


Ramon Castro .. 23 homers and 37 runs, so he only scores 14 more times on the entire season, outside of plating himself. ;-D But amazingly gets enough plate apperances to hit 23 homers. :-D


and then there is the whole Wells/Pujols thingee.. I guess those 2 sb sure weigh heavy huh ..


these are horrible numbers IMO ... horrible .
wrveres
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterEagle EyeInnovative MemberCafe Musketeer
Posts: 31204
(Past Year: -313)
Joined: 2 Mar 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby rotochamp1 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 2:40 am

wrveres,

I am not sure why you seem to look at this as an opportunity to try to diss on another site. I did not invite you to check us out as a challenge, merely as an invitation to take a look. I merely asked that people ask questions about our projections on our forums so that we would know those questions existed, I rarely check other sites for threads relating to our site.

Now to address your points of interest:

1. You call Nick Johnson, David Ortiz, and Jason Giamdi FAILURES. You do not state a reason why so I cannot contest whatever logic it is based on.

2. Jason Phillips listed at 1B and Huff at OF.
Jason Phillips played 84 games at 1B and 29 at Catcher in 2003. Aubrey Huff played 102 games in the OF in 2003. Not sure I understand why you feel these choices are out of line.

3. Mike Young over Jeff Kent. You are sure that my arguement will contradict my arguement of AROD ranked #20.
I do not recall making an arguement for AROD being #20, I only recall saying that is were we feel the value of his production will be at seasons end.

4. Tejada hitting .320 - sure it is a growth projection which we have discussed in a thread already. he could just as easily hit .310 or .300. The point is we gave our reasons for projecting the growth, and 90% of our rationale was statistically based.

5. Kendall #1 and Javy #2 - You say we bit hook line and sinker. We projected Javy to have a 24% drop in HR, a 9% drop in AVG, and 13% drop in runs scored and an increasing K rate versus 2003. Oh and rototimes also has Lopez #2. Kendall is #1 for us and we are not the only ones. Fantasy Baseball Guide also lists him #1 in their draft guide.

6. Aaron Boone #1 3B - Yes of course this was prior to his injury but how can you argue with the ranking unless you totally disagree with the projection? a 25+ HR and 25+ SB is a stud 3B. We did not adjust Boone immediately following the injury announcement as we were waiting to hear how long he would be out.

As for your SHOUT OUT to Matt. He may be a Cafer and that is great, he has also been a quality member at rotochamps over the last several weeks. I am not sure why you feel the need to rejoice just because he chose to disagree with an Admin of the site. I will be the first to tell you that WE do not feel we know everything, and we invite open respectful debate on our forums. For some reason you feel the need to act as if the members of the CAFE are some elitist special group that exist solely to tear down others who think they have some knowledge.

I also notice that for all your criticism, you did not once argue any specific piece of statistics, only the order in which we ranked them. You gave no solid numerical arguement for how you would better rank them and on what that order would be based. Your criticism comes off as equally a GUT FEELING to me as our projections apparantly do to you. Also I notice that you do not provide any customizable player projections yourself, only mock draft results. It is easy to be a critic when you do not publish a comparable product yourself.
"Nothing about this great game is trivial. There are simply some compelling bits of baseball knowledge that remain rather obscure." - Bob Costas on the meaninglessness of the expression 'baseball trivia'.
rotochamp1
Little League Legend
Little League Legend


Posts: 8
Joined: 2 Feb 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby rotochamp1 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 2:44 am

OH and regarding Castro, sometimes there are typos in the per AB calculation. When reviewing 2000 players sometimes you miss a seeing a number. Thanks for pointing it out. He has been adjusted.
"Nothing about this great game is trivial. There are simply some compelling bits of baseball knowledge that remain rather obscure." - Bob Costas on the meaninglessness of the expression 'baseball trivia'.
rotochamp1
Little League Legend
Little League Legend


Posts: 8
Joined: 2 Feb 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby rotochamp1 » Tue Feb 03, 2004 2:52 am

Oh and on the the Wells, Pujols debate. We only have them separated by $1. And that is mostly due to Wells being projected to have about 80 more atbats than Pujols, so his .330 AVG will carry more weight than Pujols at .334
"Nothing about this great game is trivial. There are simply some compelling bits of baseball knowledge that remain rather obscure." - Bob Costas on the meaninglessness of the expression 'baseball trivia'.
rotochamp1
Little League Legend
Little League Legend


Posts: 8
Joined: 2 Feb 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball

PreviousNext

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests

cron