Fantasy Baseball Cafe Forums

by **Nomar4prez** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:39 pm

Like him or hate him(I prefer to like him), Pedro is one of the best pitchers MLB has seen in a long time. He has the best win ratio of anyone currently pitching and his career ERA is as low as some of the all-time greats, even in this day of pro-hitter. With that being said, I still think Pedro is better than Prior and will continue to be for the next 2-3 years.

by **Transmogrifier** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 8:13 pm

HOOTIE wrote:A = Pedro B = Prior

Fact, Pedro displayed a lower era, 2.22 versus 2.43, in a higher scoring environement (al with dh), 4.71 versus 4.43. Show me evidence Prior is better?

Ah, Hootie... again you present one of the simplest, most compelling arguments.

by **timkell** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 8:28 pm

I don't think the Sox would make that trade at all. They clearly want to win next year. If they want to win next year, they want Schilling and Pedro.

by **HOOTIE** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 8:49 pm

timkell wrote:I don't think the Sox would make that trade at all. They clearly want to win next year. If they want to win next year, they want Schilling and Pedro.

You are probably right. Boston wants to win now. I was thinking of it in a age and salary context, without regard to now.

by **Erboes** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 10:12 pm

Pedro's an interesting case. Despite his stellar ERA and win/loss records, his domination has been slipping for a while. His WHIP is the highest since '98 (1.04, which should tell you how good that guy has been), as is his K's per 9 innings ratio. He's giving up more hits, his domination ratio has dropped nearly in half, and he's losing his unbeatable aura. The guy's the best pitcher I've ever seen, but I'm curious to see how much, if at all, he drops further this upcoming season. I have no predictions here, just observations.

by **Erboes** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 10:19 pm

Looking at Pedro's career stats, I have a question. Up into '97 with the Expos Martinez was a good pitcher. ERA of mid to upper 3's, WHIP of around 1.15, and about a K an inning, then, BAM!, he becomes "Pedro". Does anyone know if this was because he learned the changeup? Or perhaps there was something else involved. Any knowledgable responses would be appreciated.

by **HOOTIE** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 11:25 pm

Erboes wrote:Looking at Pedro's career stats, I have a question. Up into '97 with the Expos Martinez was a good pitcher. ERA of mid to upper 3's, WHIP of around 1.15, and about a K an inning, then, BAM!, he becomes "Pedro". Does anyone know if this was because he learned the changeup? Or perhaps there was something else involved. Any knowledgable responses would be appreciated.

Just a guess, but he entered 97 at age 25. He began the year with 671 career innings. Perhaps he just matured? There's a school of thought that believes pitchers in general need 500 innings in, to harnish their stuff.

by **The Cow** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 3:44 pm

Now this may sound crazy, but that Pedro for the Expos sounds a whole lot like that Wood guy for the Cubs. But there is no chance Wood improves, right??? Can't be done, players do not improve, past stats are all that matter. Wood will never stop walking people. So with that logic Pedro, Pedro never improved and never became the dominant pitcher that he WAS!!!!! It was all an evil plot by Bud Selig!!!!!

Pedro's Whip with Expos 1.15
Wood's WHIP with Cubs 1.19, how can you come within 2 walks of leading the league in walks and have a 1.19 WHIP???????

Grab the improving pitchers not the declining pitchers. I am not saying go grab the Rick Ankiels of the world. I am saying when choosing between two players of close to equal talent take the one that is on the rise not some old guy.

Last note: Yahoo rankings of the 4 pitchers based on last years stats, since you guys think you draft based on the past alone.
Drumroll please:
1. Mark Prior- The highest ranked SP
2. Kerry Wood- This surprised even me, Wood was the 5th highest rated pitcher.
3. Pedro- 6th highest and declining, am I the only one who watched him pitch last year?
4. Schilling- The 20th highest rated SP.

Are Yahoo rankings perfect, no, but they are arbitrary.
As for Prior being better than Pedro how about, more Wins despite playing on a team with an anemic offense and more K's!!!!???????

Cow OUT

by **Erboes** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 3:49 pm

Cow,

A good rule of thumb in any fantasy baseball argument is not to use Yahoo rankings. If you do you automatically lose any debate you are in because they are so ridiculously off-base that it makes you think they are done by a mafia accountant.

by **Madison** » Wed Dec 03, 2003 3:51 pm

The Cow wrote:Pedro's Whip with Expos 1.15
Wood's WHIP with Cubs 1.19, how can you come within 2 walks of leading the league in walks and have a 1.19 WHIP???????

The amount of innings that he threw plus very few hits allowed. That's how.