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Next season's top pitchers.

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Postby DK » Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:53 am

Krunk City King$ wrote:
tinfoilxtouch wrote:I won't bother ranking, but I'll make a few predictions:

2) Kazmir is going to be better than Johan. Serious.



the mets fave up on him because his mechanics seemed to indicate that he is due for a serious injury down the road. and he is throwing a lot of pitches so far this season...i doubt that he will ever be better than johan.

IMHO


On top of that, he has serious attitude problems and unless he's made a huge change in the last 2 years is going to bring a lot of bad chemistry to that clubhouse.

But the real problem with Kazmir is his unnatural motion - I think I read somewhere once that his arm moves four times the speed it should with the hip rotation he gets, meaning he puts 4x the strain on his arm than most pitchers do.

Huge injury problems down the road.
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Postby raiders_umpire » Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:47 am

DK wrote:
On top of that, he has serious attitude problems and unless he's made a huge change in the last 2 years is going to bring a lot of bad chemistry to that clubhouse.

But the real problem with Kazmir is his unnatural motion - I think I read somewhere once that his arm moves four times the speed it should with the hip rotation he gets, meaning he puts 4x the strain on his arm than most pitchers do.

Huge injury problems down the road.




Kazmirs attitude problems have settled down completely. I don't know if it is his growing older or his friendship with Crawford or not, but he has mellowed down over the last year. In fact, I would go as far to say as the he will be the leader of the clubhouse in another year or so. As far as the injury problems, of course that is a concern but he also has pitched this same way for several years now with no major problems to date yet. Kazmir has basically been injury free since the beginning of 2004 when he had a rib strain. I will admit though that the Mets should be a bit happy over the Kazmir trade. If not for the public outcry over that trade, then Minaya may never have become GM and then would Pedro, Beltran, and Delgado even be a Met in 2006?
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Postby rmande09 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 12:36 pm

Weaver is not mentioned because he is no where near as good as top 10, and never will be. His stuff is barely better than his brothers - he features all ML average stuff, with plus movement on his fastball. If he pitches from here on out, don't expect anything too impressive.

As for Cain, he will be top 10... heck, top 5 the second he decides to start throwing strikes. He is 7th in baseball with a .223 BAA. He has unreal stuff - a fastball that sits in the mid-90s, he can get it up to 98, it is heavy as hell and explodes at the end. He can throw it for 120 pitches, too. He has a hammer curve that if he starts anywhere near the plate, it is a guaranteed swing and miss. I've only seen him a few times, but I was lucky enough to see him pitch that no-hit bid against LAA... He was unreal. I've never seen hitters' knees buckle from a curveball so many times. He has two pitches that would have to rate an 80 on the ML scale, which is unparalleled (sp?). He also features a change in the mid-80s, which he could use some work on but it's more of a show-me pitch. If he develops control, he'll be unhittable for years to come.
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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:03 pm

Revised List: Top 50 for 2007
1. Johan Santana, SP, MIN (1)
2. Pedro Martinez, SP, NYM (2/3)
3. Fransisco Liriano, SP, MIN (2/3)
4. Scott Kazmir, SP, TB (3)
5. Carlos Zambrano, SP, CHC (3/4)
6. B.J. Ryan, CL, TOR (4)
7. Roy Halladay, SP, TOR (4)
8. Brandon Webb, SP, ARZ (4/5)
9. Chris Carpenter, SP, STL (4/5)
10. Roy Oswalt, SP, HOU (5)
11. Curt Schilling, SP, BOS (5)
12. Jason Schmidt, SP, SF (5)
13. Johnathon Papelbon, CL, BOS (5)
14. Joe Nathan, CL, MIN (5/6)
15. Jake Peavy, SP, SD (6)
16. Jeremy Bondermon, SP, DET (6)
17. Barry Zito, SP, OAK (7)
18. Mariano Rivera, CL, NYY (7)
19. Chris Capuano, SP, MIL (7)
20. Chris Young, SP, SD (7/8)
21. Billy Wagner, CL, NYM (7/8)
22. Bobby Jenks, CL, CWS (7/8)
23. Felix Hernandez, SP, SEA (8/9)
24. Bronson Arroyo, SP, CIN (9)
25. John Lackey, SP, ANA (9)
26. Danny Haren, SP, OAK (9)
27. Justin Verlander, SP, DET (9)
28. J.J. Putz, CL, SEA (9/10)
29. Houston Street, CL, OAK (9/10)
30. Fransisco Rodriguez, CL, ANA (9/10)
31. Dontrelle Willis, SP, FLA (10)
32. Aaron Harang, SP, CIN (10)
33. John Smoltz, SP, ATL (10)
34. Mark Buehrle, SP, CWS (10/11)
35. Jose Contreras, SP, CWS (11)
36. Tom Gordon, CL, PHI (11)
37. Ervin Santana, SP, ANA (11)
38. Chad Cordero, CL, WAS (11)
39. Ben Sheets, SP, MIL (11/12)
40. Mike Mussina, SP, NYY (12)
41. Josh Beckett, SP, BOS (12)
42. Trevor Hoffman, CL, SD (12)
43. Brian Fuentes, CL, COL (12)
44. Rich Harden, SP, OAK (12/13)
45. Mark Prior, SP, CHC (12/13)
46. Tom Glavine, SP, NYM (13)
47. Kenny Rogers, SP, DET (13)
48. Dave Bush, SP, MIL (13)
49. Nate Robertson, SP, DET (13)
50. Derek Lowe, SP, LA (13)

In paratheses are the round I think they should go in.
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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:08 pm

bump
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Postby RedWoodTree824 » Tue Jul 04, 2006 10:39 pm

Liriano.
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Postby The_Met_Threat » Tue Jul 04, 2006 11:00 pm

Belle4Hall88 wrote:bump


Kazmir too high, peavy too low. At first glance. Some other pitchers i see are too low too, and putz probably won't be closing next year, is what i see.
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Postby nirjraina » Tue Jul 04, 2006 11:01 pm

How exactly does Weaver have ML avg stuff? His last season in college he racked up 210 Ks in 144 in. And if you combine his Minor and Major league stats he has 120 Ks in 100 in.

That should easily translate into above average stuff in the ML. I know he doesnt have a 98 mph fastball but there are other ways to get ppl out.
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Postby rmande09 » Tue Jul 04, 2006 11:03 pm

nirjraina wrote:How exactly does Weaver have ML avg stuff? His last season in college he racked up 210 Ks in 144 in. And if you combine his Minor and Major league stats he has 120 Ks in 100 in.

That should easily translate into above average stuff in the ML. I know he doesnt have a 98 mph fastball but there are other ways to get ppl out.


He's a polished college pitcher and he pitches, doesn't throw. His stuff is not great, his fastball is above average and everything else is plain ol' average.
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Postby TurdFerguson » Tue Jul 04, 2006 11:07 pm

rmande09 wrote:
nirjraina wrote:How exactly does Weaver have ML avg stuff? His last season in college he racked up 210 Ks in 144 in. And if you combine his Minor and Major league stats he has 120 Ks in 100 in.

That should easily translate into above average stuff in the ML. I know he doesnt have a 98 mph fastball but there are other ways to get ppl out.


He's a polished college pitcher and he pitches, doesn't throw. His stuff is not great, his fastball is above average and everything else is plain ol' average.
I agree with everything you said.He is a mirror image of his brother.A couple of times through the league and teams will start to figure him out.I think his stuff is also very average
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