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booboo wrote:i rank those 4 guys: liriano, mccarthy, ....<big gap>...., cain, verlander
i disagree with TB13.
i'm not a fan of the young 6'5 rightee fireballer with a big breaking ball. in fact, i just traded verlander for jeremy sowers in an AL keeper league, and feel pretty good about it.
here's why i don't like those two:
1. in their younger, formidable years, they rely on gas, and never learn how to pitch. they're throwers. i think during those younger, formidable years, pitchers, who don't possess high heat, learn the craft. they learn about feel, poise, and adjusting on the fly.
2. they rarely develop a major league changeup to compliment their 95 mph+ heat.
3. command and location. neither cain or verlander have it. look at cain's and verlander's track records of walks
4. major league batter crush fastballs....even those of the 97 mph variety.
5. injury & durability. high heat = high physical effort = surgery.
6. changing speeds and disrupting a hitter's timing. yeah, 97 mph is nice. then when you throw a low 80's breaking ball without a serviceable changeup that can be thrown consistently, that's basically two speeds: 97 & 82, which makes one awfully predictable. i'd take a guy who throws 92 and 77, and hits everything in between and locates it wherever he wants, while adding and subtracting on the fastball, throwing changeups, turning that curveball into a slurve on occasion, etc.
7. pitching is an art form, a chess match. it's not some shock and awe contest where pure velocity and movement win. that's for closers who go all out, one inning at a time. these are the reasons i don't like verlander or cain.
i look at what happened to greinke. the royals tried to change him into a 95 mph power pitcher (fastball/slider combo guy). they said he had too many pitches. they wouldn't let him throw his slow breaking ball anymore. they wouldn't let him develop a knuckleball. they took away everything unique about him and tried to turn him into the prototypical verlander type. ah, poor guy.
ukrneal wrote:As pitchers gain maturity, they begin to learn more pitches. It is rare to have a pitcher come out of HS or college with 3 or 4 good pitches. Many learn 1 or 2 more in the minors, spring training, and in the Big Leagues. Many of the great pitchers only became great when they developed some new pitch to mix in with the others. This is a normal and necessary process.
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