The Cow wrote:Art Vandelay wrote:shasty mcnasty wrote:don't know if this was at least partially directed toward me, but if so, i brought up Aaron's name only in direct reference to another post which had referenced him...i'm not personally reading into his words/actions one way or another, although it's certainly well within the realm of possibility that a person might have myriad motivations for a choice such as Aaron's, only some of which they might share, for reasons of personal tact, or unwillingness to enter into controversy. On the other hand, perhaps his only motives are those he has mentioned. I haven't read his comments on the matter, but it wouldn't necessarily make him a liar if he gave one motivation without revealing all his cards...it might just make him prudent or polite, or any number of things.
Another of your lines of thought seems to be that the anti-Bonds crowd is guilty of biased treatment of stated fact/opinion in favor of their own beliefs....while this is almost assuredly undeniable, i'd hope you would an equal possibility of bias within the pro-Bonds crowd...unless i miss my guess, i'd say this is a phenomenon of the human condition at large, not so much something to be found on either one or the other side of this specific argument...
I wasn't directing anything at you, just making a general comment. It just strikes me as odd that people always talk about Aaron's class and dignity when comparing him to Bonds, then say "but obviously he's lying about why he won't go to the game." And you are absolutely correct: it's not just the anti-Bonds crowd who are selective about which sources or stories they believe depending on the content. However, I have not noticed as many Bonds supporters give credence and accept as valid anonymous sources while ignoring named sources as vice versa.
I cannot say whether or not Aaron or Bonds took steroids with 100% certainty. There is a whole lot more circumstantial evidence pointing towards Bonds though. I do not for a second believe that Bonds was the only high profile player taking roids. There were/are still loads of them is my guess. BUT when you bring up Bonds, Aaron and dignity well there is a huge chasm here. Bonds does not and has not ever shown a shred of dignity, he does not feel that he has to treat others with respect. At least that is how Bonds comes off. Aaron on the other hand is generally thought of a respectful person that exudes dignity. If Bonds wanted to be the media poster child he should have maybe at least thought about treating others with respect. Bonds made his bed and he is lying in it, he deserves all the lack of respect that he is getting. If Bonds were a more likeable player like say Griffey his breaking the home run record would be full of glitz and fan fare. But Bonds chose to not treat others with respect, so why should Bonds expect any respect?
I don't know what this has to do with my post, but I'll reply anyway: Bonds shouldn't expect respect, and people shouldn't expect him to treat them respectfully after they've (they being fans, media, etc) had a disdainful relationship with eachother for years. The reason I mentioned the perceived class and dignity of Aaron was not to compare him to Bonds, but to ask, if he is indeed full of dignity and class, then why do people accuse him of lying about his motivations for not going to the record-breaking game? People say "oh, Hank Aaron was a great man. Full of class, treated people with respect, saved my kitten from a tree once...but he's lying about this." It makes no sense. If you think Aaron is a great, dignified man, don't you have to accept his reasoning at face value and not come to your own conclusions so that his actions will fit into whatever keyhole you want to put them in?