Return to Baseball Leftovers

H2H Points League: issues with 2-start pitchers. please help

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

H2H Points League: issues with 2-start pitchers. please help

Postby Dan Lambskin » Thu Feb 16, 2006 3:51 pm

we're in the 3rd year of a redraft H2H points league on CBS and are having a dispute about the value of 2-start pitchers

scoring is as follows (7 P slots (SP or RP):
Scoring for Pitching Categories
BBI - Walks Issued (Pitchers) -0.5 points
CG - Complete Games 5 points
ER - Earned Runs -1 point
HA - Hits Allowed -0.5 points
INN - Innings 2 points
K - Strikeouts (Pitcher) 1 point
S - Saves 10 points
W - Wins 10 points

throughout the year (and especially during playoffs) people will scour the WW for some scrub (think Nate Robertson or Tomo Ohka) in place of a better pitcher or a RP and the next week drop said scrubs for next weeks 2-start slut

it casued quite a dispute (never mind that it's a huge gamble that your scrub wont get rocked for 7 runs in 2 1/3 each outing and get you negative points...i've beaten that horse to death already)

anyway, has anyone else run into this problem and if so what do you do about it?

we're kickinga around several ideas:
have 2 RP and 5 SP slots (or 2 RP 4 SP and a P)
impose a transaction limit
charge for transactions
limit the # of pitcher pickups per week/month
average the score 2-starts (not sure if CBS supports this...i'm not commish)

there's basically an even split down the league, those who think it's fine and those who want something done (but what?)
Dan Lambskin
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeLucky Ladders ChampionPick 3 Weekly WinnerMatchup Meltdown SurvivorTrivia Time Trial Monthly Winner
Posts: 10224
(Past Year: -1)
Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball


Postby Mugwump » Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:35 pm

I play in a similar league... We have a set number of transactions for the year. So, picking up the 2 start scrub happens, but not as often as it sounds like in your league. Hope that helps.
I was in Los Angeles, and the team was playing in San Diego, but I didn't know it. I had taken LSD at noon. I thought it was an off-day. At 1pm, my girlfriend and trip partner looked at the paper and said, "Dock, you're pitching today!"
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 582
Joined: 1 May 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: On the mound, pitching a no hitter, hallucinating.

Postby TheRock » Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:46 pm

Problem with a transaction limit is the playoffs then becom eabout who has the most transactions left to load up on pitching. Best solution I've seen is a weekly IP limit.
General Manager
General Manager

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterMock(ing) Drafter
Posts: 3055
(Past Year: 3)
Joined: 16 Apr 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: America's Heartland

Postby tms298 » Thu Feb 16, 2006 6:49 pm

you could adjust the scoring-perhaps an inning pitched is only worth 1.5 and a negative value for a losing pitcher
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 614
(Past Year: 1)
Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Harrisburg, PA

Postby biju » Thu Feb 16, 2006 7:18 pm

A league I'm in has a very similar scoring structure. The difference is -3 for a loss. While people still scour for 2 start pitchers there are a very limited number of 2 start pitchers who are already available and have favorable matchups. In many cases starting a stud pitcher will still outscore the 2 start scrub.

Consider with my scoring:

Stud pitcher goes 7 INN, 5 Ks, about 8 hits/walks, 3 ER and a W. Score: 22 pts.

Scrub goes in two games: 12 INN, 7 Ks, about 16 hits/walks, 7 ER and one W, one L. Score: 23 pts.

if the case happens where he gets dinged up once and goes fewer innings, gets no-decisions or worse gets 2 Ls you can quickly get into the single digit or even minus points. The stud pitcher will likely still net you 10 points even if he has an off day.

Of course the scrub could also go: 14 INN, 8 Ks, 16 h/w, 6 ER and 2 Ws to get 42 points but I would say the liklihood that this guy isn't already scooped up is low. Plus the swing is too great to have a consistently winning team. Yeah, you might break the bank a couple times but the risk of doing this with your entire starting pitcher lineup is low.

It's much more of a risk when the negative points are added.
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1077
Joined: 6 Mar 2004
Home Cafe: Football

Postby bucksox » Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:35 pm

this happens in our league as well. The thought I have is this. It seems as an owner you fall into a couple of camps:

1. You are okay with it because you either use it and feel it works or you don't because you are comfortable with your game plan and have seen the 2 start backfire.

2. It really bothers you because you feel you are somehow being cheated. Which secretly seems like you feel it works but is "immoral"

if you want to win. You need to get in camp #1 somehow or add a stat for punishing par/sub-par pitchers such as -5 for losses.
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 540
Joined: 6 Mar 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby JTWood » Thu Feb 16, 2006 11:28 pm

We limit transactions and freeze rosters for the playoffs.
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

User avatar
CafeholicCafe WriterEagle EyeWeb Supporter
Posts: 11508
Joined: 22 Jun 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Unincorporated Heaven

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests