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H2H Playoff ethics...final day strategy?

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 12:42 am
by socceryank
I am currently ahead 6-4 going into the final day tomorrow. It would appear that I am guaranteed to clinch 5 of those positions regardless of how my team does. The one category that is up for grabs is AVG. I believe that if I benched my entire starting lineup, my opponent would not be able to catch me, whereas he could if I had a bad day. Would you guys think this was unethical? This is my first year doing H2H, and do not want to go against any "unwritten rules."

BTW...I cannot catch him in any other batting category.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:41 am
by mweir145
I've done that before, and I don't see that as unethical, though I've been known to be "wrong" before. :-b

But really, you aren't doing hindering the other guy's success, and from what I know of the rules, you can bench anybody you want on any day. So go ahead. ;-D

BTW, in my matchup this week, because the guy is behind by 20 or so ks, and 4 wins, he dropped 5 members of his team tonight, and picked up 5 spot starters in an attempt to win those categories. He has to win them (as he is far behind in most of the others that I'm currently leading in), or else he will be relagated to the 3rd place game next week. I've used this strategy before, and I see nothing wrong with it, but I'm not sure if it's entirely "ethical."

Does anybody think it's not?

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:22 am
by Madison
I don't see benching your guys as a problem at all. Happens all the time with pitchers to protect era/whip leads, so no different for batters and an avg lead.


mweir145 wrote:BTW, in my matchup this week, because the guy is behind by 20 or so ks, and 4 wins, he dropped 5 members of his team tonight, and picked up 5 spot starters in an attempt to win those categories. He has to win them (as he is far behind in most of the others that I'm currently leading in), or else he will be relagated to the 3rd place game next week. I've used this strategy before, and I see nothing wrong with it, but I'm not sure if it's entirely "ethical."

Does anybody think it's not?


Personally, I hate that tactic and do consider it unethical. H2H leagues are designed to be my team versus your team. Not my team versus you team and the entire free agent pool. If this is a private league, I'd come up with some rules to prevent this from happening next year, or just boot the other owner and find a replacement during the offseason.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:25 am
by mweir145
Madison wrote:
mweir145 wrote:BTW, in my matchup this week, because the guy is behind by 20 or so ks, and 4 wins, he dropped 5 members of his team tonight, and picked up 5 spot starters in an attempt to win those categories. He has to win them (as he is far behind in most of the others that I'm currently leading in), or else he will be relagated to the 3rd place game next week. I've used this strategy before, and I see nothing wrong with it, but I'm not sure if it's entirely "ethical."

Does anybody think it's not?


Personally, I hate that tactic and do consider it unethical. H2H leagues are designed to be my team versus your team. Not my team versus you team and the entire free agent pool. If this is a private league, I'd come up with some rules to prevent this from happening next year, or just boot the other owner and find a replacement during the offseason.

The owner is one of the smarter and good guys in the league, not to mention that he actually runs it. I don't think he would do it if he thought it was unethical.

I still can't really see how it's actually "wrong" though, you aren't actually hindering the other guy's success (in this case, me), it is just a last shot at victory when there appears to be almost no hope. I can't say I fault him for doing so.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:33 am
by Madison
mweir145 wrote:The owner is one of the smarter and good guys in the league, not to mention that he actually runs it. I don't think he would do it if he thought it was unethical.

I still can't really see how it's actually "wrong" though, you aren't actually hindering the other guy's success (in this case, me), it is just a last shot at victory when there appears to be almost no hope. I can't say I fault him for doing so.


Being smart and/or the commish has nothing to do with it.

H2H is designed to be Team A versus Team B for one week.

Dropping 5 guys to pick up 5 spot starters on the final day of the week to try to win the counting catagories is not the way the game was intended to be played. Simple as that.

Most leagues have already started new rules to prevent the loophole from being exploited, such as inning maxes for the week, or using percentages rather than totals (K/9, win %, save %, etc.) Those things help bring the game back to where it was designed to be played and eliminates the "quantity over quality" tactic.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:48 am
by mweir145
Madison wrote:
mweir145 wrote:The owner is one of the smarter and good guys in the league, not to mention that he actually runs it. I don't think he would do it if he thought it was unethical.

I still can't really see how it's actually "wrong" though, you aren't actually hindering the other guy's success (in this case, me), it is just a last shot at victory when there appears to be almost no hope. I can't say I fault him for doing so.


Being smart and/or the commish has nothing to do with it.

H2H is designed to be Team A versus Team B for one week.

Dropping 5 guys to pick up 5 spot starters on the final day of the week to try to win the counting catagories is not the way the game was intended to be played. Simple as that.

Most leagues have already started new rules to prevent the loophole from being exploited, such as inning maxes for the week, or using percentages rather than totals (K/9, win %, save %, etc.) Those things help bring the game back to where it was designed to be played and eliminates the "quantity over quality" tactic.

He's not exactly the commish, he just runs the league on our forum and website. I doubt he would do it if he thought it was the "wrong" thing to do.

So you think it would be a good idea to implement inning maxes for the week next year? I might have to say something about that.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 2:52 am
by Sultans of Squat
I think there will always be some amount of discrepancy though because you can't force teams to play the same number of innings like in a real baseball matchup.

I think the only way to eliminate the discrepancies w/out being too restrictive on gameplay is to use a good points system and then place an upper limit on games for batters and IP for pitchers. That would come much closer to a real baseball matchup too, IMHO.

Too bad Yahoo doesn't support a combo of points *and* H2H to allow this. OTOH, I still don't like how whacky Sept gets for fantasy since guys sit, callups eat up playing time, rotations get shifted around, etc. But that would certainly interest me enough to give a H2H points league a good try.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:14 am
by Madison
mweir145 wrote:He's not exactly the commish, he just runs the league on our forum and website. I doubt he would do it if he thought it was the "wrong" thing to do.

So you think it would be a good idea to implement inning maxes for the week next year? I might have to say something about that.


You would know more about him than me, but I can say that what he's doing is not the way the game was intended to be played. Take that as you will.

As to weekly inning caps, I support them, and it helps remove this tactic from play. ;-D

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:37 am
by ironman
If you're trying to ensure you've locked up 5 of the categories, make sure one is ERA because that's the tiebreaker cat. in Yahoo.

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2005 12:09 pm
by mweir145
ironman wrote:If you're trying to ensure you've locked up 5 of the categories, make sure one is ERA because that's the tiebreaker cat. in Yahoo.

I know, and I'm .12 behind in that with his 5 spot starters, I should be okay.