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Giants release Pierzynski

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Postby TownDrunk » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:09 pm

They need help in the rotation? That's the last place they need help at. Sabean is very pleased with it, said it's probably the best rotation he's had to date. He rejected a lot of offers for Lowry and Williams at the meetings.

Right now, the rotation is the teams best strength.
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Postby LBJackal » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:15 pm

No, the hitting is the team's strength. 2nd in runs, 10th in ERA last year. The rotation has Schmidt, and uh.... a cut and paste 2 through 5. Tomko is a decent #3, Lowry is a risky #4 at best, Rueter should retire. Then they have Jerome Williams who is another #3 for the rotation. Adding a closer helps, but they don't have a #2 starter. The only guy they can rely on is Schmidt. Lieber could have been that #2 SP instead of adding Vizquel.
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Postby TownDrunk » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:39 pm

The reason why the offense was so potent last year was because of a resurgence of Snow, and Grissom put up another 20 dingers and drove in a lot of RBI. Also, AJ had 77 RBI and was in the top 20 in the league with RISP. AJ is gone now, and both Snow and Grissom have gotten another year older. It would be unrealistic to believe that those two can put up the same numbers. The offense will suffer next season without a move for another bat.

Schmidt is the best pitcher in baseball. Tomko pitched like an ace during the second half, and should perform well for a full season next year now that he’s had a full year with the Giants. Williams was one of the top pitching prospects in baseball, and was on pace to win 15 games last year before going down with an injury. Rueter is still effective, and the improved defense greatly helps him out. Lowry went undefeated last season, and made adjustments at the end of the year. He was dominating at times himself. And Foppert is fully healthy and back, and is dominating winter ball.

So no, your statement is inaccurate. The offense will be a problem next year, while the rotation is probably the best in the division and is very reliable.

And again, the Vizquel signing is a tremendous upgrade at short. But since you’re always right about everything……
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Postby Tony Clark is my son » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:45 pm

The Giants are an "offensive" team because of one man: Barry Bonds. His stats lie because he creates runs in ways stats cannot reflect. He's the bat in the lineup every pitcher avoids and dreads. Can you imagine is a pitcher is cruising along, then gives up a pop-fly double to the guy in front of Bonds, they then intentionally walk Bonds (every time). That messes up a pitcher's rhythm, and thus creates runs.

But the addition of Matheny is primary defensive. Pierzynski was good offensively, bad defensively, and had a bad attitude. They figure they gain more in defense and moral than they lose in offense, and they're right. Good move! ;-D
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Postby LBJackal » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:53 pm

Yes I'm always right about everything, everybody knows that.

But anyway, I won't get into the Vizquel thing because even if he shows to be a waste of money again you won't believe it because he was below average last year and you thought he was superb...

Anyway I know the offense isn't 2nd best in the NL. But it's top 5. They added Vizquel who can still hit even though his fielding range went down the tubes, and the rest is the same except AJ. The rotation is not even close to top 5 in the NL. Tomko is NOT a good pitcher. 2 good months doesn't erase a career's worth of stats. Jerome Williams is OK but not more than a #3 starter. Rueter is still effective if you consider an annual 4.50-5.00 ERA effective (that's actually not bad for a #5). So there; a #1 in Schmidt, a #3/#4 in Tomko and Jerome, and a #5 in Rueter. Other than Schmidt nobody there can be relied on when you need them. Lieber instead of Vizquel would have been an addition that turned a team fighting for a wildcard spot into a team that would be likely division champions.

Just be happy that you guys got rid of that awesome closer Hermanson and got Benitez... this is my last post on the subject because it seems you can't think rationally about the Giants.
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Postby Dawgpound 1613 » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:58 pm

Schmidt is the best pitcher in baseball. Tomko pitched like an ace during the second half, and should perform well for a full season next year now that he’s had a full year with the Giants. Williams was one of the top pitching prospects in baseball, and was on pace to win 15 games last year before going down with an injury. Rueter is still effective, and the improved defense greatly helps him out. Lowry went undefeated last season, and made adjustments at the end of the year. He was dominating at times himself. And Foppert is fully healthy and back, and is dominating winter ball.


Let's not go overboard. I agree that offense is the issue with the Giants, and while the pitching is solid, it's not like they have the Cubs rotation. Schmidt isn't the best pitcher in the NL, much less all of baseball. I'll take Santana any day of the week. He is a Top 5 guy in the NL, though.

Tomko has a career ERA of 4.53 and only in his rookie year did he have an ERA under 4. As for the second half of 2004, all I can say is even a blind squirrel . . . .

Williams and Foppert while talented, are coming off injuries. And a 4+ ERA in winter ball is not "dominating."

Lowry is good - but, again, let's see him do it for more than half a season. That said, I'm highest on his ability to contribute.

As for Rueter, well, if you can't say anything nice . . . . More hits than innings, more BB than K. I just don't see him with an ERA under 4.5 with those numbers.

So while I agree on offense being a need, I don't think the pitching is so solid as to be ignored.
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Postby Mookie4ever » Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:43 pm

Too bad about AJP - another one on my NL-only keeper league falls grrr. At least there is a chance that he stays in the NL.

Apparently his teammates hated him. He couldn't get along with anybody and is one of the only players I know that was benched for "being an ass". He was also in a terrible slump to start the year and didn't do nearly as well as they (or I had hoped for last year).

This guy needs an attitude adjustment or he will be out of baseball fast. Catchers are supposed to be leaders not goofs - that what pitcher are for.
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Postby TownDrunk » Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:55 pm

I’m glad it’s your last post, since you seem to be so uninformed about the team.

Dawg,

You can make a case that Schmidt is the best pitcher in the league. You can also make an argument for RJ as well, I see that. But you can’t dismiss him.

Again, you had to watch Tomko pitch in the second half. He seemed like a new pitcher. This will be the first time in a while that he’s actually stuck with the same team for over a year. He seems comfortable here, and there’s no reason to think that he can’t maintain the caliber of stuff he showed in the 2nd half for the whole season next year. I, and many other Giants fans, are expecting it to carry over. It’s a tossup between Hermanson and Tomko as to who was the most important player keeping the team in the playoff hunt last year, Bonds not withstanding.

Williams and Foppert are both healthy, and both have talent. Foppert’s winter ball ERA is bloated because of a bad start his last time up. Up until that time, he was cruising. Sabean and Alou have sang nothing but praise about him.

Last year, I didn’t think Lowry could keep his success up. I didn’t like the separation between his changeup and fastball. But, he did make adjustments at the end of the year, and seeing that bolstered what I think of him. He’s going to turn into a fine #3 starter, possibly even a #2.

With Rueter, you need a solid defense behind him in order for him to be successful. Last year, the Giants didn’t have that. However, they have added Vizquel and Matheny, so that helps. And from all reports, Sabean is looking to upgrade CF defensively. So again, that should help. I’d expect an ERA above 4, with 13 wins. However, I would really like to see Foppert beat him out in ST for the last spot.

I never said this rotation was as good as the Cubs. However, it is reliable and is probably the best in the division. Good mix of veteran and youth talent. Given the fact that the offense will probably hit the toilet next season without an addition, this will be the teams’ strength. They really do need to add a top set up guy though for the pen.

That said, the Giants need to be focused on acquiring a bat for the outfield. It would be foolish to believe that Snow and Grissom can duplicate the same numbers last season, and you've already lost AJ.
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Postby TheYanks04 » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:27 pm

Well for what it is worth, they did sign Jeff Fassero to a minor league deal (LOL):


Rotoworld:
Giants signed LHP Jeff Fassero to a minor league contract and invited him to spring training.
If he makes the Giants as a middle reliever, it will be the ninth team for soon-to-be 42-year-old Fassero. He hasn't had a sub-5.00 ERA since 2001, but he wasn't horrible as a spot starter and middle reliever for the Rockies last season.
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Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 15, 2004 12:04 am

So who is going to sign AJP? Houston, Cincy, LA, Pitts, ????
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