Womack?...To the Yanks? - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Womack?...To the Yanks?

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Postby FatGuyWithAMullet » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:24 am

ajgnydc722 wrote:I'm not thrilled about Wright. I don't know much about him, how good is he? Does anyone (Braves/Indians fans) know if he can succeed in the Bronx?


I doubt it unless the Yankees trade Mel Stottlemyre for Leo Mazzone. How often do Mazzone reclamation projects replicate their success they had under him when they sign with another team? I doubt Wright will suddenly revert back to his San Diego form, but it depends on how much of what Leo taught him he retained.
FatGuyWithAMullet
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 850
Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Uranus

Postby SaintsOfTheDiamond » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:27 am

FatGuyWithAMullet wrote:
ajgnydc722 wrote:I'm not thrilled about Wright. I don't know much about him, how good is he? Does anyone (Braves/Indians fans) know if he can succeed in the Bronx?


I doubt it unless the Yankees trade Mel Stottlemyre for Leo Mazzone. How often do Mazzone reclamation projects replicate their success they had under him when they sign with another team? I doubt Wright will suddenly revert back to his San Diego form, but it depends on how much of what Leo taught him he retained.


Jason Maruis? :-? :-°
Image
Member #4 of the Inaugural Yadier Molina Fan Club!!!
SaintsOfTheDiamond
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero

Fantasy ExpertCafe WriterCafe Ranker
Posts: 6480
Joined: 6 May 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Swiping second

Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:27 am

Womack is 35.

A career .274 hitter with an OBP of .319 (AWFUL). and an OPS of .681 (AWFUL).

He is no youngster.
He Ks way too much and does not walk. Just what is to like about a guy that one could make the argument is a rick man's version of Pokey Reese?

This is a HORRIBLE signing.
TheYanks04
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero


Posts: 9531
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:28 am

SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:
FatGuyWithAMullet wrote:
ajgnydc722 wrote:I'm not thrilled about Wright. I don't know much about him, how good is he? Does anyone (Braves/Indians fans) know if he can succeed in the Bronx?


I doubt it unless the Yankees trade Mel Stottlemyre for Leo Mazzone. How often do Mazzone reclamation projects replicate their success they had under him when they sign with another team? I doubt Wright will suddenly revert back to his San Diego form, but it depends on how much of what Leo taught him he retained.


Jason Maruis? :-? :-°


More like Denny Neagle.
TheYanks04
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero


Posts: 9531
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby FatGuyWithAMullet » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:31 am

SaintsOfTheDiamond wrote:
FatGuyWithAMullet wrote:
ajgnydc722 wrote:I'm not thrilled about Wright. I don't know much about him, how good is he? Does anyone (Braves/Indians fans) know if he can succeed in the Bronx?


I doubt it unless the Yankees trade Mel Stottlemyre for Leo Mazzone. How often do Mazzone reclamation projects replicate their success they had under him when they sign with another team? I doubt Wright will suddenly revert back to his San Diego form, but it depends on how much of what Leo taught him he retained.


Jason Maruis? :-? :-°


Marquis, Schmidt and Odalis Perez weren't reclamation projects though. I'm talking about pitchers like John Burkett.
FatGuyWithAMullet
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 850
Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Uranus

Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:37 am

Burkett was also a product of the NL though. He pitched well or decent for a good portion of his career with the Giants and FLa. When he went to Tex he got lit up. He went back to the NL in Atl and pitched pretty decent. Then went back to the AL and got lit up again.

How much Mazzone really had to do with that I don't know. I think Burkett was just one of those pitchers that the pitcher's hitting and the 3 or 4 gimme outs in the lineup each game really made a difference.
TheYanks04
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero


Posts: 9531
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby FatGuyWithAMullet » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:47 am

TheYanks04 wrote:Burkett was also a product of the NL though. He pitched well or decent for a good portion of his career with the Giants and FLa. When he went to Tex he got lit up. He went back to the NL in Atl and pitched pretty decent. Then went back to the AL and got lit up again.

How much Mazzone really had to do with that I don't know. I think Burkett was just one of those pitchers that the pitcher's hitting and the 3 or 4 gimme outs in the lineup each game really made a difference.


Someone sent me this link the other day when we were talking about pitching coaches. I didn't really study his research and mathematics, but the results really stood out to me when I read them.

http://www.sabernomics.com/

How Good is Leo Mazzone?

So, what's the veridict? Leo Mazzone is a damn good coach! Working with Leo is shaves off between .55 and .85 points of a pitcher's ERA. And I promise you, the results are not some artifact of some manipulation of the numbers to prove a point. In fact, my bias when I started this project was that Leo was a bit overrated. To put this in perspective, the standard deviation of ERA for pitchers in the sample was 1.36. Leo's boys gain about half of a standard deviation on their ERA. I think Schuerholz ought to take this number into arbitration hearings with pitchers. Also interesting is the fact that the effect seems to go away when pitchers leave. This may be because Mazzone imparts useful everyday help, not just new knowledge to fix an old problem, or maybe the Braves know when to dump guys. In any event I think it's clear Rob Neyer was not exaggerating when he suggested Leo Mazzone ought be in the Hall of Fame.
Last edited by FatGuyWithAMullet on Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
FatGuyWithAMullet
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 850
Joined: 15 Jun 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: Uranus

Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:53 am

I do not doubt Mazzone's ability. I just do not think it really mattered much wrt Burkett. I also think the result is in no small part through overall design. Meaning they do indeed seem to know how t oevaluate pitching talent and when to get rid of someone who is not likely to repeat a short-term fluke (see Hammond, Neagle and others).
Last edited by TheYanks04 on Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
TheYanks04
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero


Posts: 9531
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

Postby Amazinz » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:53 am

Too bad he can't teach his guys how to pitch in the post-season. :-b
Image
Maine has a good swing for a pitcher but on anything that moves, he has no chance. And if it's a fastball, it has to be up in the zone. Basically, the pitcher has to hit his bat. - Mike Pelfrey
Amazinz
Mod in Retirement
Mod in Retirement

User avatar
CafeholicFantasy ExpertCafe WriterCafe RankerMock(ing) DrafterEagle EyeWeb SupporterPick 3 Weekly WinnerSweet 16 SurvivorLucky Ladders Weekly Winner
Posts: 18800
Joined: 16 Mar 2004
Home Cafe: Baseball
Location: in Canada, toughening up figure skaters

Postby TheYanks04 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 1:57 am

You can only work with what you have and having guys like Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz certainly goes a long way to making you look smart. It can't make them win in the post-season though. And for all the pitching accolades over the years, the Braves usually found themselves either lacking offensively or in the pen.
TheYanks04
Hall of Fame Hero
Hall of Fame Hero


Posts: 9531
Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Home Cafe: Baseball

PreviousNext

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Jahemeneves, Ray Zorback and 8 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Today's Games
Wednesday, Oct. 1
(All times are EST, weather icons show forecast for game time)

San Francisco at Pittsburgh
(8:07 pm)

  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact