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Cards' Offer For Randy

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Cards' Offer For Randy

Postby StlSluggers » Thu Nov 18, 2004 10:33 am

The Post-Dispatch (actually, the New York Newsday) is reporting that there is intensive bidding for the Big Unit and the Cards are throwing all of their chips on the table.

St. Louis Post-Dispatch wrote:Big Unit Update: Yanks, Cards, White Sox in the Running
STLtoday.com Sports
11/17/2004

New York's Newsday reports that the Yankees have intensified their bid to sign lefthander Randy Johnson, with their main competition coming from the Cardinals and the Chicago White Sox.

According to Newsday, the Cardinals have proposed a three-pitcher package in exchange for Johnson: righthanders Dan Haren and Kiko Calero and lefthander Rick Ankiel.

The White Sox are believed to have offered first baseman Paul Konerko and righthanded pitcher Jon Garland.
Newsday reported that the Yankees now will consider trading 28-year-old righthander Javier Vazquez for Johnson, 41. New York tried to trade for Johnson in July, but when Arizona asked for Vazquez, the Yankees refused.

Vazquez had a terrible second half, going 4-5 with a 6.92 earned-run average after the All-Star break. He is owed $34 million over the next three years. According to Newsday, the Yankees would pay some of Vazquez's salary if they can make the deal with Arizona.

Johnson, who is 6-foot-10 and nicknamed the "Big Unit," is owed $16.5 million for 2005. He has a no-trade clause and thus has the final say in any deals the Diamondbacks try to make. Johnson has publicly stated that he wants to go to a team with a legitimate shot at winning the World Series.

The Arizona Republic reported in today's editions that the Anaheim Angels also are interested in trading for Johnson, but no specifics were discussed.

According to reports out of Arizona, Johnson will meet with Diamondbacks GM Joe Garagiola Jr., later this week to discuss his situation.

The Yankees also are talking to free-agent lefthanded relievers Steve Kline and Ron Villone. The Cardinals are not expected to attempt to re-sign Kline.
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Postby Pogotheostrich » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:20 am

According to Newsday, the Cardinals have proposed a three-pitcher package in exchange for Johnson: righthanders Dan Haren and Kiko Calero and lefthander Rick Ankiel.


8-o WOW! I've heard Haren or Ankiel but not both. I think that would do it. The question is will Randy waive his no trade cause?
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Postby StlSluggers » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:26 am

Pogotheostrich wrote:
According to Newsday, the Cardinals have proposed a three-pitcher package in exchange for Johnson: righthanders Dan Haren and Kiko Calero and lefthander Rick Ankiel.

8-o WOW! I've heard Haren or Ankiel but not both. I think that would do it. The question is will Randy waive his no trade cause?

I was pretty shocked, too. I'm guessing that Steinbrenner has really turned up the heat on the offer and the talent is all that Jocketty has to deal. If 'Zona is truly in search of talented youth, this seems like a pretty darn good offer to me. I have to think that they're seriously considering it.

I was really hoping that Ankiel would get to spend a year with a guy like Johnson. I think he could learn a lot from him.
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Postby StlSluggers » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:29 am

Do you think I should post this story out in the Fantasy Baseball Talk room, too?
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Postby SaintsOfTheDiamond » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:58 am

Pogotheostrich wrote:
According to Newsday, the Cardinals have proposed a three-pitcher package in exchange for Johnson: righthanders Dan Haren and Kiko Calero and lefthander Rick Ankiel.


8-o WOW! I've heard Haren or Ankiel but not both. I think that would do it. The question is will Randy waive his no trade cause?


I really hope they don't do it. Haren is going to be good for a long time IMO and Ankiel could return to his former form eventually. I think it's an awful deal personally. I'd rather them go after Clement or hell even Pavano if he can be had cheap enough. After looking back on the postseason I don't think having RJ would have made that big a difference. They needed more solid SP's all around. Perhaps Carpenter would have made a big enough difference, but I still think they need more than just RJ. Maybe I'm overvaluing Haren and Ankiel, I just think it's kind of selling out for next year or '06 at most. :-/
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Postby StlSluggers » Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:38 pm

I couldn't agree more. While Randy is great and would be spectacular with this Cardinals offense behind him, Jocketty has to know that he has the key players on this team locked up for a few more years. He does not have the "win now or win never" pressure that a lot of other teams have. That means that he doesn't have to mortgage the future to win next year. Haren is a good talent, and Ankiel... Well, we all know what he can do.

I agree that a more cost-efficient alternative to the Unit would be a Pavano or a Clement. With one of them and Carpenter, you will have two very solid pitchers at one and two for the playoffs. This offense doesn't need more than that.
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Postby SaintsOfTheDiamond » Thu Nov 18, 2004 5:05 pm

StlSluggers wrote:He does not have the "win now or win never" pressure that a lot of other teams have. That means that he doesn't have to mortgage the future to win next year. Haren is a good talent, and Ankiel... Well, we all know what he can do.

I agree that a more cost-efficient alternative to the Unit would be a Pavano or a Clement. With one of them and Carpenter, you will have two very solid pitchers at one and two for the playoffs. This offense doesn't need more than that.


Whew, I thought I was the only one who thought that. :-° :-D
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Postby j_d_mcnugent » Thu Nov 18, 2004 7:01 pm

that offer started out as a suggestion and soon morphed into a rumor. now places are saying the cards actually did make that offer. however, jocketty denied the rumors saying that while the cards have strong interest in unit no offers have been made. additionally, he has said numerous times any trade for unit would likely involve us trading away some salary and the alleged offer does not involve us shedding any salary. i seriously doubt he will trade away haren and ankiel. its possible one may go, but not both. i find it more likely some combination of marquis, calero, wainwright, thomas, gall or another B grade prospect is what jock is willing to part with.
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Postby Mookie4ever » Thu Nov 18, 2004 7:16 pm

The Diamonbacks should take the Chicago offer.
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Postby JTWood » Fri Nov 19, 2004 12:07 am

Mookie4ever wrote:The Diamonbacks should take the Chicago offer.

I guess that's not a bad offer. Konerko's 28 and very talented. Garland doesn't seem like he's super-talented. His numbers aren't that hot, low-lighted by 34 home runs last year. I'd never heard of him before, but ESPN wasn't too high on him:

ESPN wrote:Garland always has been a live-arm guy, with a fastball that dives when he does not overthrow it. He has developed a curveball that is nasty at times but has not been consistent enough with either the curve or his changeup. He also has failed to increase his velocity since reaching the big leagues, remaining in the 91-93 MPH range. He needs to make strides in one of those areas to jump to the next level. He did throw a few more strikes in 2003, walking only 3.5 opponents per nine innings.

I think the D-backs could do better than that from either the Cards or the Yanks. The Cards will offer more, younger talent. The Yanks will just fling cash at a team still paying for its World Series ring.
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