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Cafe AL MVP voting thread!

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AL MVP?

Sir Vlad
24
45%
Manny
11
21%
Sheffield
5
9%
Johan
2
4%
Big Papi
4
8%
Tejada
4
8%
Ichiro
1
2%
Pudge
2
4%
someone else...
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 53

Postby LBJackal » Mon Nov 15, 2004 11:25 pm

HOOTIE wrote:LBJ how was protection debunked?


Somebody posted a link to a study that showed players who bat in different spots in the order do better when they are in front of worse hitters. I think it was strictly a correlation, which is always a sign of a flawed study. The players who get moved from a good spot in the order often do so because they were playing bad. Also, in front of a good hitter, you get more late inning AB's against top RP's. It wasn't evidence that was showing cause and affect, it was just a correlation.

If people who drink a glass of red wine 5 times per week make on average over $250K per year, that doens't mean that by drinking 5 glasses of wine per week, you're going to become rich. It means that you drink 5 glasses of wine per week because you're rich. Just for an example. (I know you know about this Hootie, just throwing it out there to show why correlations can be meaningless).
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Postby blankman » Tue Nov 16, 2004 12:10 am

May I ask who voted for Ichiro and why? :-?

I voted for Sheffield, but thats majorly because I just want him to win, lol ;-)
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Postby buffalobillsrul2002 » Tue Nov 16, 2004 12:20 am

I voted for Manny, but I think that people are leaving out Johan Santana (I know he's a pitcher, but still, I think he carried his team to the playoffs as much as anybody) and Varitek (you can't underrate him being the heart and soul of that team, reagardless of the numbers).
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Postby DK » Tue Nov 16, 2004 5:24 pm

Well, there's your answer.

The writers have spoken.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:09 pm

Madison wrote:
LBJackal wrote:
Madison wrote:
Transmogrifier wrote:I say Manny. I think Vlad will win it, I don't think he should, though... the numbers just aren't there.


8-o

They aren't? :-?

Vlad: .337-39-126 with 124 runs and 15 steals.

Manny: .308-43-130 with 108 runs and 2 steals.

Hmm..... :-?


I went with Vlad. ;-D


Manny's OPS: 1.009
Vlad's OPS: 0.989

There's more than just BA and RBI/R. OPS tells a much more accurate story. The big BA lead Vlad has isn't as important considering Manny has a better OBA and SLG.

I'm not saying Manny should win.... but the numbers are pretty close between them. Vlad will probably take it considering that the Boston votes will be split. And Manny's defense leaves much to be desired (although to his defense, he has to contend with the green monster).


I happen to agree. ;-D I just tossed the basics out there to show that Vlad does indeed have the numbers to make it interesting. ;-)


I'm getting to my rebuttal late, but I'll just say that Vlad trailed Manny in nearly all categories, especially slugging and OBP.

As my brother said to me, had Vlad had the same OBP as Manny for the whole year, he likely wouldn't have had to go HR crazy the last week to get his team to the playoffs.

Plus, Manny is simply a better hitter--works the count, makes the pitcher throw tons of pitches, etc.

I think the defensive differences and Vlad's last week put him over the top. Personally, I think a game in April is just as important as a game in September.
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Postby SaintsOfTheDiamond » Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:16 pm

Transmogrifier wrote:Plus, Manny is simply a better hitter--works the count, makes the pitcher throw tons of pitches, etc.

I think the defensive differences and Vlad's last week put him over the top.

Personally, I think a game in April is just as important as a game in September.


Agreed, agreed, and agreed. ;-D ;-D ;-D All I can add is that for the last one, that's the way it should be, but since humans are the ones deciding, last impressions are far more incluencial than they really should be. :-/
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Postby Madison » Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:43 pm

Transmogrifier wrote:I'm getting to my rebuttal late, but I'll just say that Vlad trailed Manny in nearly all categories, especially slugging and OBP.

As my brother said to me, had Vlad had the same OBP as Manny for the whole year, he likely wouldn't have had to go HR crazy the last week to get his team to the playoffs.

Plus, Manny is simply a better hitter--works the count, makes the pitcher throw tons of pitches, etc.

I think the defensive differences and Vlad's last week put him over the top. Personally, I think a game in April is just as important as a game in September.


Personally, Vlad's last two weeks don't have anything to do with me taking him as my choice (other than the total stats for the year). I look at the totals, not when they happened ;-) .

Manny had a good year as ususal, but the most valuable player in the American League this year was Vlad. I don't see it any other way.
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Vlad

Postby baseballrich » Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:00 pm

He is the best player going bar none In The fantasy world he tops everyone because of SB's and RBI's - In the real world he tops everyone because of defense and arm strenght-quality. By the time he is 42 he will be passing Bonds easily
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Postby LBJackal » Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:08 pm

bb rich, are you Wilton Guerrero or something?

Just because you can't carry your brother's jock doesn't mean you have to ride it :-b
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Postby baseballrich » Wed Nov 17, 2004 2:22 pm

I've seen him play many times. When he gets a pitch to hit he crushes it. By the way he has the best arm in the game and plays a pretty good OF. His 600 AB's certainly have more of an impact than Bonds 375...I'm not sure why no one else see's the advantage of 25% moe AB's???
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