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Should Green play on Yom Kippur?

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Postby Bloody Nipples » Fri Sep 24, 2004 12:54 am

thehat wrote:
ocmusicjunkie wrote:Shawn Green using Jewish holidays for vacation is SUCH total BS.

The other major sports play on Christmas Day. We play on Easter.

And why exactly does this holiday prevent him from playing? If he wanted to go outside and play baseball with his kids on that day, is that against his religion too?

It's a classic case of someone exploiting a minority group they happen to be in for personal gain.


What "personal gain" is there in this for Green? I really can't see where there is a problem here. Guys are given days off for personal matters on a regular basis. It's one game.

As for your contention re: Christmas and Easter. It's apples and oranges. The way I understand it, on this particular Jewish holiday, work of any kind is prohibited and there is to be no food eaten on the holiday. It is the day of atonement.

There are no such requirements for Christmas and Easter. And, as far as Christmas is concerned, there are no games played in any professional sport on Christmas Eve and very few on Christmas Day. The NHL usually doesn't play any and the NBA has a couple....big TV games as they know everyone will be home.

Comparing a day where we open presents and sit around the house with family stuffing ourselves to this Jewish holiday just doesn't wash.


You are right about Yom Kippur, 100% (I think :-? ). I am Jewish, so I hope I'm right. If Green wants to follow his religious beliefs and not work on Yom Kippur, he should do so.

OCMJ, Christians players dont take time off for Christmas and/or Easter for 2 reasons. 1, there are hardly ever games on those days because they are almost like national holidays at this point. 2, because neither holiday requires that you not work or do strenuous activities.
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Postby Dodger Blue » Fri Sep 24, 2004 1:26 am

Madison wrote:I have no problem with Green taking off. Religion is not something I debate or look down on anyone for. If he believes he needs to not play, then so be it. It obviously was a big enough thing for him to make sure it got written into his contract that he's allowed off for it and I know he's taken it off in the past. I really don't see what the problem is here.


Madison got it about right. Three things are way more important than baseball. 1. God If you don't believe then how did the world come about from "nothing." Think about this for at least a day before replying please. 2. Family 3. Country.
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Postby Bloody Nipples » Fri Sep 24, 2004 1:58 am

Dodger Blue wrote:
Madison wrote:I have no problem with Green taking off. Religion is not something I debate or look down on anyone for. If he believes he needs to not play, then so be it. It obviously was a big enough thing for him to make sure it got written into his contract that he's allowed off for it and I know he's taken it off in the past. I really don't see what the problem is here.


Madison got it about right. Three things are way more important than baseball. 1. God If you don't believe then how did the world come about from "nothing." Think about this for at least a day before replying please. 2. Family 3. Country.


I respect your right to believe in religion, but please respect other's right to not. Maybe if we replaced God with "community" a more general list could be made to include those who dont believe in god.
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Postby Lofunzo » Fri Sep 24, 2004 2:54 am

DK wrote:
ocmusicjunkie wrote:Shawn Green using Jewish holidays for vacation is SUCH total BS.

The other major sports play on Christmas Day. We play on Easter.

And why exactly does this holiday prevent him from playing? If he wanted to go outside and play baseball with his kids on that day, is that against his religion too?

It's a classic case of someone exploiting a minority group they happen to be in for personal gain.


You can't possibly be serious.

The man wants to be a part of his religion! Did it ever occur to you that Yom Kippur may be a service that takes part all day, unlike Christmas and Easter?

He won't be taking a vacation. I'll bet you he'll be in temple.


DK.......I agree with you 100% but only have 1 problem. How come he doesn't take off for the holiday every year?? It seems to me that if it was so important to him, he would take the day every year.
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Postby LBJackal » Fri Sep 24, 2004 3:03 am

Dodger Blue wrote:
Madison wrote:I have no problem with Green taking off. Religion is not something I debate or look down on anyone for. If he believes he needs to not play, then so be it. It obviously was a big enough thing for him to make sure it got written into his contract that he's allowed off for it and I know he's taken it off in the past. I really don't see what the problem is here.


Madison got it about right. Three things are way more important than baseball. 1. God If you don't believe then how did the world come about from "nothing." Think about this for at least a day before replying please. Thought about it for my entire life; religion is bullshit. 2. Family Family Guy maybe; my family can be boring at times 3. Country. Fair enough; they keep me safe, I should at last try my best to respect it and protect it.
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Postby ukrneal » Fri Sep 24, 2004 7:24 am

Here's a short explanation form Judaism 101. It explains just why this holiday is so important.

"Yom Kippur is probably the most important holiday of the Jewish year. Many Jews who do not observe any other Jewish custom will refrain from work, fast and/or attend synagogue services on this day. Yom Kippur occurs on the 10th day of Tishri. The holiday is instituted at Leviticus 23:26 et seq.

The name "Yom Kippur" means "Day of Atonement," and that pretty much explains what the holiday is. It is a day set aside to "afflict the soul," to atone for the sins of the past year. In Days of Awe, I mentioned the "books" in which G-d inscribes all of our names. On Yom Kippur, the judgment entered in these books is sealed. This day is, essentially, your last appeal, your last chance to change the judgment, to demonstrate your repentance and make amends.

As I noted in Days of Awe, Yom Kippur atones only for sins between man and G-d, not for sins against another person. To atone for sins against another person, you must first seek reconciliation with that person, righting the wrongs you committed against them if possible. That must all be done before Yom Kippur.

Yom Kippur is a complete Sabbath; no work can be performed on that day. It is well-known that you are supposed to refrain from eating and drinking (even water) on Yom Kippur. It is a complete, 25-hour fast beginning before sunset on the evening before Yom Kippur and ending after nightfall on the day of Yom Kippur. "

Anyway, it's not the first time that Morris has stuck his foot in his mouth.

Finally, I suspect that Green did not play on Yom Kippur in the past unless it was a day game before the first sundown. Jewish holidays start at sundown (hence you have to eat BEFORE sundown not AT sundown), so if he had a game before that evening, he could play in it. The problem arises when the game is on the day following the first sundown (or after sunset of the beginning of the holiday) as the holiday runs from sundown to sundown (more or less). In fact, I know there were no games that he played in on that day prior to 2001 and last year, they didn't make the playoffs, so he didn't last year either. Don't forget that Jewsih holidays are determined by the cycle of the moon, not the sun, and so the date changes every single year (dates in Sept and Oct).

Ken Rosenthal of the Sporting News has a good article on the subject. He has a good quote, "Many non-Jews do not grasp the meaning of Yom Kippur; there is no holiday like it in Christianity."
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Postby RayD » Fri Sep 24, 2004 9:09 am

Dodger Blue wrote:
Madison wrote:I have no problem with Green taking off. Religion is not something I debate or look down on anyone for. If he believes he needs to not play, then so be it. It obviously was a big enough thing for him to make sure it got written into his contract that he's allowed off for it and I know he's taken it off in the past. I really don't see what the problem is here.


Madison got it about right. Three things are way more important than baseball. 1. God If you don't believe then how did the world come about from "nothing." Think about this for at least a day before replying please. 2. Family 3. Country.


Oops, you forgot 4. Apple Pie.
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Postby Patella Tendon » Fri Sep 24, 2004 9:59 am

If Saturday's game was a night game, Shawn probably would have played because that would have been allowed.
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Postby Chopper » Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:18 am

LBJackal wrote:1. God If you don't believe then how did the world come about from "nothing." Think about this for at least a day before replying please. Thought about it for my entire life; religion is bullshit. 2. Family Family Guy maybe; my family can be boring at times 3. Country. Fair enough; they keep me safe, I should at last try my best to respect it and protect it.


LBJ, for the most part, I agree. I do, however, generally support others' right to suspend rational thought when it doesn't hurt me directly. As for the second, I don't think a ballplayer should be able to leave a late-inning game early to get home for Family Guy. They can afford to buy a TiVo.
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Postby Transmogrifier » Fri Sep 24, 2004 10:19 am

It's sad that this is even a debate. It's one game.
I'm back. Sorta.

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