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Rivera>Cy Young????

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Postby pgbridge2000 » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:14 pm

I don't give him Cy Young not on the grounds that he's not as good as gagne but on the grounds that he is not as dominant against top teams as he used to be (case and point Red Sox on Saturday?) and he has had better seasons in terms of dominance than this one if playoffs counted towards the Cy Young I'm sure Rivera would be making people consider him come October but since it doesn't I'll confine him to the award of Hall of Famer
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Postby Amazinz » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:22 pm

BigBlue wrote:Huh? What happened to that guy named Jason Schmidt?!?! I heard he had a pretty good year and got ROBBED!!!!!!!

Schmidt definitely had a Cy Young-caliber year last year and it's a shame they don't give out two awards. Gagne had the most dominant season ever for a reliever and he deserved it. It's a shame but Schmidt was not robbed IMO. ;-)
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Postby thetongueofire » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:25 pm

yep i agree. even though he had a sweet year, i dont think he was robbed. he only made 29 starts and was only able to throw 200-odd innings. Gagne was pretty much inhuman last year.
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Postby Lofunzo » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:43 pm

Amazinz wrote:
BigBlue wrote:Huh? What happened to that guy named Jason Schmidt?!?! I heard he had a pretty good year and got ROBBED!!!!!!!

Schmidt definitely had a Cy Young-caliber year last year and it's a shame they don't give out two awards. Gagne had the most dominant season ever for a reliever and he deserved it. It's a shame but Schmidt was not robbed IMO. ;-)


Quite possibly but only by a hair, if at all. I'm sure that many of you here aren't familiar with Eckersley's 1990 campaign:

Eckersley (1990)
W-L: 4-2
IP: 73.1
SV: 48
H: 41
ER: 5
BB: 4
K: 73
ERA: 0.61
WHIP: 0.61

Gagne (2003)
W-L: 2-3
IP: 82.1
SV: 55
H: 37
ER: 11
BB: 20
K: 137
ERA: 1.20
WHIP: 0.69

I might give Gagne the edge because of the K advantage although Ech smoked him in the K/BB ratio (18.25 - 6.85).
Last edited by Lofunzo on Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Tavish » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:48 pm

I don't think there is ever a season where a closer deserves the Cy Young award. An award named after a guy who averaged 290 IP in his career should not go to a guy who pitches 70. The Rolaids award is plenty of recognition for which reliever performed the best.
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Postby LBJackal » Thu Sep 23, 2004 5:56 pm

4 walks 8-o

How about SV%? I'm sure it must have been close to 100% if he allowed so few ER, but IMO SV% is a very key part of a closer's statline. Gagne didn't blow any which is amazing. Can't believe taht season isn't more talked about 8-o but still, I'd say Gagne's was better.
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Postby bluefire7 » Thu Sep 23, 2004 6:04 pm

unless santana really REALLY blows up from here on out, it's gunna be him.

rivera is a loooong shot. but if you asked me if i had the choice of gagne or rivera in a game, leave everything on the line... i'd still go with the proven goods. i'd like to see LA in the playoffs and see how eric does first.
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Postby thetongueofire » Thu Sep 23, 2004 6:14 pm

Lofunzo wrote:Gagne (2003)
W-L: 2-3
IP: 76.1
SV: 55
H: 47
ER: 11
BB: 20
K: 137
ERA: 1.20
WHIP: 0.69


not to be a total ass or anything, but Gagne pitched 82.1 innings and allowed 37 hits. ;-D

anyways, Gagne might not be in the playoffs this year and Rivera hasnt been so good against the Sox which makes him totally "anti-clutch" for the Yankees.

i've got no idea who had the better year. i was 3 when Eckesrley had his season and frankly didnt know he was this good. ;-D
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Postby BigBlue » Thu Sep 23, 2004 6:53 pm

Tavish wrote:I don't think there is ever a season where a closer deserves the Cy Young award. An award named after a guy who averaged 290 IP in his career should not go to a guy who pitches 70. The Rolaids award is plenty of recognition for which reliever performed the best.


This is exactly how I feel! Same goes w/ a pitcher for MVP imo. They have the Cy Young!
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Postby Amazinz » Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:11 pm

Lofunzo wrote:
Amazinz wrote:
BigBlue wrote:Huh? What happened to that guy named Jason Schmidt?!?! I heard he had a pretty good year and got ROBBED!!!!!!!

Schmidt definitely had a Cy Young-caliber year last year and it's a shame they don't give out two awards. Gagne had the most dominant season ever for a reliever and he deserved it. It's a shame but Schmidt was not robbed IMO. ;-)


Quite possibly but only by a hair, if at all. I'm sure that many of you here aren't familiar with Eckersley's 1990 campaign.

No doubt Eckersley's '90 campaign was awesome as well as '92 when he actually won the Cy Young. But Gagne did not blow a save. That is primarily what I'm referring to when I said the most dominant ever.

Also, Eckersley was in the running in '90 but lost to a 27-game winner. I'm not sure how many SVOs Eckersley had in '90 because they didn't keep track of the stat and I don't have it handy. Eckersley blew 3 SVOs in '92 when he won the Cy Young.

As for Tavish's comment, there's some validity to that argument but since there was a precedent for awarding relievers the Cy Young there is absolutely no way they could overlook Gagne last year.
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