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Postby thehat » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:07 am

donut wrote:let's say i called the cops and said you threatened the life of our president even though you never said such a thing. the secret service knocks on your door arrests you and you are on the eve of trial, where you're tried for treason b/c of your alleged threats. a conviction carries a life sentence. then the secret service tells you all you have to do is issue an apology without admitting guilt and charges will be dropped, even though the chances of you getting convicted is 10%. what would you do? i know i'd sign that apology!!! rather than risk a 10% chance of me rotting in jail. also your assertion of her not dropping charges is splitting hairs. she is primarily the whole prosecution's case. just b/c someone is charged for a crime does not mean something criminal happened.


No offense, but your argument here is empty. If you called the cops and simply said that I made some kind of threat, I would not be arrested. You would have to have some kind of proof, such as a recording or a written document. And in this case, had the girl simply accused Bryant of sexual assault with no proof whatsoever, he would not have been charged.

I'm not suggesting for a moment that innocent people aren't occasionally charged with crimes they did not commit. Maybe Kobe is one of those few, maybe not. If you conduct a survey in any prison, all the inmates will tell you they're not guilty. Obviously, that just ain't the case. The fact is that most people are absolutely guilty of crimes they are charged with, and it is often difficult to prove this in court. Whether or not Kobe is or was, we may never know. But I remain convinced that something "unusual" happened here.

I will also suggest that the real villain here, beyond Kobe, and beyond the girl, is the backwoods prosecutor who does not know his ass from his elbow. His handling of this case has been mind boggling from day one. This idiot makes the Clark/Darden combo look like geniuses.
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Postby DieHardCubbie » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:50 am

thehat wrote: the backwoods prosecutor who does not know his ass from his elbow.


8-o ...I am almost certain he knows which one to wipe when.... :-b

But I agree the prosecution and the judge both dropped the ball on this case.... :-/
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Postby donut » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:11 pm

thehat wrote:
donut wrote:let's say i called the cops and said you threatened the life of our president even though you never said such a thing. the secret service knocks on your door arrests you and you are on the eve of trial, where you're tried for treason b/c of your alleged threats. a conviction carries a life sentence. then the secret service tells you all you have to do is issue an apology without admitting guilt and charges will be dropped, even though the chances of you getting convicted is 10%. what would you do? i know i'd sign that apology!!! rather than risk a 10% chance of me rotting in jail. also your assertion of her not dropping charges is splitting hairs. she is primarily the whole prosecution's case. just b/c someone is charged for a crime does not mean something criminal happened.


No offense, but your argument here is empty. If you called the cops and simply said that I made some kind of threat, I would not be arrested. You would have to have some kind of proof, such as a recording or a written document. And in this case, had the girl simply accused Bryant of sexual assault with no proof whatsoever, he would not have been charged.

no offense taken...my argument is somewhat weak. however don't use the apology as a sign that she was raped or likely raped. making an empty apology even though one is innocent to prevent a possible life sentence is a no-brainer. the reason i took exception to the statement that if charges are filed there is "substantial indications that a crime took place. I cannot see how any clear thinking individual can think otherwise" that i feel is not true. i currently have a case pending where charges were filed against me. a person bought a used computer from me off e-bay almost a year ago. he told the D.A. or cops that he never recieved the computer. now he never told me this or complained to me. this is the first time i've heard anything about this. i told the assistant D.A. that this never occured and i have the shipping reciept and tracking # to prove it. she told me i could've sent an empty box. i replied that the shipping price is relative to weight. she counter with, i could've sent rocks!!! b/c the computer in question was over $400 i'm being charged with a felony. so far i've spent $5000 for a retainer on a lawyer and was told that if the case is not dismissed and goes to trial i'll be in the hole for at least another $10,000. all this for a $500 computer. now if the D.A. came and told me all i had to do is sign a apology letter to the guy even though i did nothing wrong, i would sign it in a heartbeat!!
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Postby Madison » Fri Sep 03, 2004 5:09 pm

donut wrote:no offense taken...my argument is somewhat weak. however don't use the apology as a sign that she was raped or likely raped. making an empty apology even though one is innocent to prevent a possible life sentence is a no-brainer. the reason i took exception to the statement that if charges are filed there is "substantial indications that a crime took place. I cannot see how any clear thinking individual can think otherwise" that i feel is not true. i currently have a case pending where charges were filed against me. a person bought a used computer from me off e-bay almost a year ago. he told the D.A. or cops that he never recieved the computer. now he never told me this or complained to me. this is the first time i've heard anything about this. i told the assistant D.A. that this never occured and i have the shipping reciept and tracking # to prove it. she told me i could've sent an empty box. i replied that the shipping price is relative to weight. she counter with, i could've sent rocks!!! b/c the computer in question was over $400 i'm being charged with a felony. so far i've spent $5000 for a retainer on a lawyer and was told that if the case is not dismissed and goes to trial i'll be in the hole for at least another $10,000. all this for a $500 computer. now if the D.A. came and told me all i had to do is sign a apology letter to the guy even though i did nothing wrong, i would sign it in a heartbeat!!


As to Kobe, the apology itself screamed "I'm guilty!". All you have to do is listen to it, or read it. Now I still don't know for sure if he's gulity or not, but the apology actually hurt his credibility more than helped it in my eyes.

As to your situation, there's no way I'd sign an apology letter. I'd have already launched a countersuit for court costs, defamation of character, and time wasted. I'd have zero issues with calling his lie and making it as public and as big of a deal as humanly possible.
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Postby donut » Fri Sep 03, 2004 7:12 pm

i'll agree with you that the apology hurt kobe's credibility.

i would love to sue that guy but what lawyer would take my case. i surely can't afford to pay a lawyer to sue him. i would be happy to give a lawyer half of whatever he recovers from that guy though! anyone know of a lawyer in So. Cal. that would take this case? i also really doubt the guy has money.
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Postby Madison » Fri Sep 03, 2004 10:40 pm

donut wrote:i'll agree with you that the apology hurt kobe's credibility.

i would love to sue that guy but what lawyer would take my case. i surely can't afford to pay a lawyer to sue him. i would be happy to give a lawyer half of whatever he recovers from that guy though! anyone know of a lawyer in So. Cal. that would take this case? i also really doubt the guy has money.


He's got the money to hire a lawyer to come after you doesn't he? I'd say he's got something worth getting. As to who would take the case, have you called any attorneys? I'm sure someone out there would be more than happy to do it for a percentage of whatever you win.
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Postby donut » Sat Sep 04, 2004 2:25 pm

Madison wrote:
donut wrote:i'll agree with you that the apology hurt kobe's credibility.

i would love to sue that guy but what lawyer would take my case. i surely can't afford to pay a lawyer to sue him. i would be happy to give a lawyer half of whatever he recovers from that guy though! anyone know of a lawyer in So. Cal. that would take this case? i also really doubt the guy has money.


He's got the money to hire a lawyer to come after you doesn't he? I'd say he's got something worth getting. As to who would take the case, have you called any attorneys? I'm sure someone out there would be more than happy to do it for a percentage of whatever you win.


he didn't hire a lawyer to recover damages. he got the D.A. to file criminal charges against me. i'll heed your advice and call a few lawyers on tuesday.
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Postby Madison » Sun Sep 05, 2004 1:35 am

donut wrote:he didn't hire a lawyer to recover damages. he got the D.A. to file criminal charges against me. i'll heed your advice and call a few lawyers on tuesday.


Ah, I see now. I'd still give it a shot. An attorney or two would still probably take the case. The guy who filed the charges is still looking to recover damages. If by some weird chance you were found guilty, the guy who filed the charges would end up getting his money.

Odd, but true story. I sold a baseball card collection a long time ago and when the guy showed up, he liked what he saw and we negotiated price. I gave him a small break in price, but I also kept a few of the cards. We were both happy with the deal and he asked me if I would take a check. I really didn't like the idea, but it was a Bank One check (Bank One is big in Texas) and he did have a valid Texas driver's license, so I took it. I also jotted down the license plate and make/model of car he was in while he was looking at the collection. I went to Bank One to cash it and found out that there was not enough money in the account to cash the check. In other words, it was worthless. So I called my attorney to find out what exactly I was supposed to do. He told me to contact the D.A., which I did. When I gave the check to the D.A. and told him the story, he left the room for a bit and when he came back he had 6 pictures and asked me if I could identify the man. I did and he confirmed that I was correct. Turns out that guy stole his roommate's birth certificate and had a valid driver's license made. He opened an account and ordered checks. Then he started bouncing them everywhere. Even wrote a check to Kowasaki for $12,000 and purchased a motorcycle. I didn't feel like such an idiot once I heard that. Anyway, I filled out the paperwork on what happened and told the D.A. to throw the book at him. Turns out the license plate was the key. It was a girlfriend of his car and they were able to track him down and get him. About 6 months after my only trip and only conversation with the D.A., I got an envelope in the mail from the Tarrant County Corrections Agency. By now I had completely forgotten about the cards, but inside was a check for the full amount of the bounced check. That was a very nice day for me.

Sorry for the rambling, but the bottom line is that he is trying to get money. I say you take him for all you can. Just filing a countersuit might be enough to get him to forget the whole thing and I'm sure an attorney would file the paperwork for a nominal fee. Or go for the throat and get an attorney who will go after everything for a fee. Take your pick. :-)
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