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Postby wkelly91 » Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:55 pm

I love it...

Earl Weaver
Billy Martin
Larry Bowa

:-b
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Postby Philly22 » Sun Jul 11, 2004 6:27 pm

Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t
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yeah

Postby JOEG » Sun Jul 11, 2004 6:54 pm

Yeh but look how much the crowd loves him! That place was going nuts
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Postby WhiteHot » Sun Jul 11, 2004 7:08 pm

Philly22 wrote:Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t


Because he got thrown out?
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Postby beltrans_boy » Sun Jul 11, 2004 7:12 pm

WhiteHot wrote:
Philly22 wrote:Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t


Because he got thrown out?


No, because the Phillies are only a game in first place in the league's weakest division.

:-t
[size=10]"Men are apt to mistake the strength of their feeling for the strength of their argument." [/size]
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Postby WhiteHot » Sun Jul 11, 2004 7:19 pm

beltrans_boy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:
Philly22 wrote:Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t


Because he got thrown out?


No, because the Phillies are only a game in first place in the league's weakest division.

:-t


And that is the manager's fault...how?
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Postby beltrans_boy » Sun Jul 11, 2004 7:25 pm

The Phillies have so much talent on both sides of the ball, for them to have such a mediocre record is unbelieveable. They are probably the most well-rounded and talented team in the National League (aside from a healthy Chicago squad). I don't know for a fact, but all the evidence points to Larry Bowa as being a terrible clubhouse manager. There's absolutely no excuse for that Philly team to be in a playoff race with the Mets, Marlins and Braves. They should be running away with that division.

I kind of like Bowa as a player and as a person, but looking at this Philadelphia Phillies team, he just doesn't have the tools to manage a big league ballclub.
[size=10]"Men are apt to mistake the strength of their feeling for the strength of their argument." [/size]
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Postby WhiteHot » Sun Jul 11, 2004 8:16 pm

I just don't see how much can be the manager's fault in baseball. Sure, there are cases when you leave a pitcher in too long or change pitchers at a bad time or something, but I just don't see how much else can be contributed to a manager.

We know the Phillies have a lot of talent, but if Millwood and Myers have been sucking a$$ and Wolf, Padilla, and Telemaco have been hurt, that's Bowa's fault? Maybe you could argue that with Brenly or Baker, but Bowa has not been using his pitchers like those two. I've watched pretty much every game and Bowa is quite conservative.

If Thome has a .160 something average with RISP, that's Bowa's fault too? I don't see it. Rollins slumped early in the year, Byrd was terrible, so they had no real leadoff hitter for a while. It's Bowa's fault that those guys weren't hitting?

In football, coaches must call plays and make quick switches. In basketball, they run different plays, sub on matchups, etc. In baseball, all a manager can do is shift fielders, take out pitchers, and pinch-hit players. In baseball a LOT more so than football, it's up to the players to perform.

Blaming Bowa for a poor team performance (especially pitching) seems too easy and ignorant. A lot of things went wrong, but to blame Bowa is to just regurgitate what misinformed reporters have been saying for a while.
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Postby Baseballer02 » Sun Jul 11, 2004 8:16 pm

WhiteHot wrote:
beltrans_boy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:
Philly22 wrote:Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t


Because he got thrown out?


No, because the Phillies are only a game in first place in the league's weakest division.

:-t


And that is the manager's fault...how?


Well if you wanna look at it that way, why is the Astros struggles Jimy Williams' fault, why was Bob Brenly fired if the Dbacks struggles weren't his fault? Hell if the manager's don't matter at all, why even have them?
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Postby WhiteHot » Sun Jul 11, 2004 8:21 pm

Baseballer02 wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:
beltrans_boy wrote:
WhiteHot wrote:
Philly22 wrote:Bowa is a bad bad manager. :-t


Because he got thrown out?


No, because the Phillies are only a game in first place in the league's weakest division.

:-t


And that is the manager's fault...how?


Well if you wanna look at it that way, why is the Astros struggles Jimy Williams' fault, why was Bob Brenly fired if the Dbacks struggles weren't his fault? Hell if the manager's don't matter at all, why even have them?


Give me a break. Saying that you don't need managers is stupid. But you seem to overemphasize their importance. Jimy Williams made a lot of questionable moves with platooning and Brenly obviously overworked his pitchers into the DL. I can't say the same thing about Bowa.

Plus, the Diamondbacks are a bad team. You think that firing Brenly will turn them around? If you do, you're crazy. They mortgaged their future on Sexson and it backfired. I don't think any manager could make their a contender with their talent. Firing managers is an easy way to show that you care and are doing something about it. Will it make a difference? Most likely not.

Also, you say, "why is the Astros struggles Jimy Williams' fault," like it's a fact. If you think anytime a team struggles that it's the manager's fault, that's crazy. There are things called slumps, injuries, selling off a bullpen (Wagner, Dotel), and other things that influence things a lot more than someone who can point at the bullpen.
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