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What method of scoring does YOUR league use...please look.

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What method of scoring does your league use?

Poll ended at Mon Jul 05, 2004 11:15 am

Roto (H2H or Standard)
19
66%
Points
10
34%
 
Total votes : 29

What method of scoring does YOUR league use...please look.

Postby warrick95 » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:15 am

I am writing an article...would like to know this information.

Note: if you play in more than one league, choose the scoring that the majority of your leagues use. Thanks for taking the time, guys.

H2H and standard Roto are rather similar, so they are both listed together.
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Postby DaQ » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:21 am

I like points leagues because then one player can really affect the team. If Barry Bonds hits a walk-off HR, it definately helps in points league, but may not really matter in roto or H2H.
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Postby Quaker » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:24 am

I play both, but my main money league is points- a format that I prefer.
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Postby Madison » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:36 am

Big difference in Roto and H2H.

Personally, I prefer Roto. Best team over the long haul. ;-D

H2H involves more luck and who's hot come the playoffs so that takes 2nd place of the 3 types.

Points finish dead last due to the ability to punt catagories and/or exploit the scoring system. Not close to real baseball at all most of the time.
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Postby warrick95 » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:41 am

Hey Mad, your post interests me. I'm trying to figure out what the best way to score is...to make it most realistic to baseball.

When looking at Roto based leagues (meaning with cats worth the same amount of "points") one main thing stuck out to me:
That they're all worth the same. A homer is worth as much as a stolen base. A win as much as a save. In real baseball, IMO, these things are all worth different amounts of points.

Thus, I'm writing an article trying to find the best possible scoring method to Fantasy Baseball.

Points leagues do not require you to have a "balanced" team like in Roto, but don't they incorporate the most aspects of the game of baseball? Isn't it the most realistic, too, due to the varying levels of importance given to each statistical category? There are ways to punt categories and stuff, but isn't that realistic, too? I mean, some teams choose to play small ball, while others (A's and Sox) choose to get on base and wait for the big hit. There are many ways to skin a cat in the MLB as well as Points leagues, so doesn't that just increase the realism?

I don't know, but it's JMO.

Note: I strongly prefer 5X5 Roto, too. ;-D
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Postby Madison » Fri Jul 02, 2004 11:58 am

warrick95 wrote:Hey Mad, your post interests me. I'm trying to figure out what the best way to score is...to make it most realistic to baseball.

When looking at Roto based leagues (meaning with cats worth the same amount of "points") one main thing stuck out to me:
That they're all worth the same. A homer is worth as much as a stolen base. A win as much as a save. In real baseball, IMO, these things are all worth different amounts of points.

Thus, I'm writing an article trying to find the best possible scoring method to Fantasy Baseball.

Points leagues do not require you to have a "balanced" team like in Roto, but don't they incorporate the most aspects of the game of baseball? Isn't it the most realistic, too, due to the varying levels of importance given to each statistical category? There are ways to punt categories and stuff, but isn't that realistic, too? I mean, some teams choose to play small ball, while others (A's and Sox) choose to get on base and wait for the big hit. There are many ways to skin a cat in the MLB as well as Points leagues, so doesn't that just increase the realism?

I don't know, but it's JMO.

Note: I strongly prefer 5X5 Roto, too. ;-D


The quest for the perfect scoring system is probably something that will elude all fantasy players forever. No system out there is perfect, but 5x5 roto is very close. ;-)

Contrary to popular belief, a homer and a steal are not worth the same amount of points in roto. Check your free agent pool. What's easier to find? Homers, or steals? I'd be willing to bet you can find someone who could pop a couple of homers out while steals are a bit harder to find. The scarcity makes them worth more. Same for wins vs. saves. Plus you have to take the other catagories into play. Average/era/whip/etc. Points leagues don't always penalize you for your player's weaknesses. 1/6 with a 2 run shot in a points league? Good deal. 1/6 with a 2 run shot in a roto league and it doesn't look as good.

As to points leagues, I've played many different variations of scoring systems and they can always be manipulated. Some are hitting heavy, some are pitching heavy, some favor power hitters, some favor relievers, etc. There's almost always a way to manipulate the system. How many real life teams only have middle relievers and closers? How many only have .250 avg power hitters?

Sure, it's similar to real baseball where teams do "punt" a catagory. Like the A's don't steal bases, or the Yankees being a bunch of power hitters. Difference is that neither of those teams is guaranteed to win anything. In a points league, if you find the flaw in the system, you will win. That's where the big difference is.
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Postby easygoing » Fri Jul 02, 2004 12:01 pm

In baseball, you have to go Roto... no one ever talks about that fact that so and so hit 345 in May of 2000, but most people know the end of the year average. And since there are so many games, the best team usually wins out once all is said and done.

In football, on the other hand, the games are played once a week basically one game can really mean something in the course of a season (295yrd game for Jamal Lewis last year, 5 TD game for Alexander 2 years ago).... those are the things many people remember.
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Postby warrick95 » Fri Jul 02, 2004 12:34 pm

Madison wrote:
warrick95 wrote:Hey Mad, your post interests me. I'm trying to figure out what the best way to score is...to make it most realistic to baseball.

When looking at Roto based leagues (meaning with cats worth the same amount of "points") one main thing stuck out to me:
That they're all worth the same. A homer is worth as much as a stolen base. A win as much as a save. In real baseball, IMO, these things are all worth different amounts of points.

Thus, I'm writing an article trying to find the best possible scoring method to Fantasy Baseball.

Points leagues do not require you to have a "balanced" team like in Roto, but don't they incorporate the most aspects of the game of baseball? Isn't it the most realistic, too, due to the varying levels of importance given to each statistical category? There are ways to punt categories and stuff, but isn't that realistic, too? I mean, some teams choose to play small ball, while others (A's and Sox) choose to get on base and wait for the big hit. There are many ways to skin a cat in the MLB as well as Points leagues, so doesn't that just increase the realism?

I don't know, but it's JMO.

Note: I strongly prefer 5X5 Roto, too. ;-D


The quest for the perfect scoring system is probably something that will elude all fantasy players forever. No system out there is perfect, but 5x5 roto is very close. ;-)

Contrary to popular belief, a homer and a steal are not worth the same amount of points in roto. Check your free agent pool. What's easier to find? Homers, or steals? I'd be willing to bet you can find someone who could pop a couple of homers out while steals are a bit harder to find. The scarcity makes them worth more. Same for wins vs. saves. Plus you have to take the other catagories into play. Average/era/whip/etc. Points leagues don't always penalize you for your player's weaknesses. 1/6 with a 2 run shot in a points league? Good deal. 1/6 with a 2 run shot in a roto league and it doesn't look as good.

As to points leagues, I've played many different variations of scoring systems and they can always be manipulated. Some are hitting heavy, some are pitching heavy, some favor power hitters, some favor relievers, etc. There's almost always a way to manipulate the system. How many real life teams only have middle relievers and closers? How many only have .250 avg power hitters?

Sure, it's similar to real baseball where teams do "punt" a catagory. Like the A's don't steal bases, or the Yankees being a bunch of power hitters. Difference is that neither of those teams is guaranteed to win anything. In a points league, if you find the flaw in the system, you will win. That's where the big difference is.


I fully agree that 5X5 roto is probably the most fun Fantasy Baseball experience.

However, the realism of it troubles me.

Your paragraph that basically explains that stolen bases are worth more than home runs in Roto actually backs up what I'm saying. I think stolen bases should not get many points. Tell me, in a real baseball game, how significant is a stolen base compared to a home run? A stolen base normally puts a guy into scoring position, or closer to home. However, a home run takes you all around and scores a run. What is of more importance to a team, a home run or a stolen base? Methinks a home run and home runs should be weighted over stolen bases. It's unrealistic to value speed so much. Players like Soriano are nowhere near as valuable in real life as they are in Fantasy. That's unrealistic, IMO.

Manipulation is definitely the main problem to points leagues, it seems. Is there a way around it? I think so. If everybody was more educated of the game and of the way to manipulate, they would draft accordingly, correct? Thus, the draft order of players may differ from Roto, but it would even out. If players were smarter, the shortcuts would be known and all would try to take them. It's just like taking power/speed guys early in Roto drafts.

Is there a way to use outs as a category for Points league hitters, to give negative points (sort of like the batting average).

In addition, would a small minimum/maximum innings window prevent starting too many pitchers and starting only MRs/CP's?
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