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Santana WAS a reliever. Now he's a STUD!!

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Postby NZF » Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:18 pm

KolbSaves wrote:yeah I'm still worried about when he faces some real competition...


I could not agree more.

Shutting down three NL teams in interleague play that have never had the advantage of seeing him before has caused a major over reaction of this guys ability. Look at his numbers pitching in the weakest dvison in the majors in April and May.

Also I don't buy into this argument that he was tipping his pitches. To me that is rubbish. He was way over rated coming into the season. He is still a very nice 3rd or 4th pitcher to have on your roster and his K's are great but you guys are kidding yourselves if you think he is ever going to be a fantasy pitching stud.
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Postby Quaker » Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:20 pm

4.61 ERA does not equal stud. I'll get excited when he gets it under 3.5.

In order to be considered a stud, you need to have produced for an entire season.

Right now, "hot pitcher" is more appropriate.
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Postby NZF » Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:24 pm

Twinskies wrote:Are you kidding?? He just turned in another gem today, 8IP 12K 2ER...not to mention his past 3 starts. you can now start him with confidence because he is throwing as well as anyone else in the league, and anyone who doubted him should be eating their words by now.


His last four starts before interleague play he lost in a row to Tampa Bay, Kansas City, White Sox and Toronto. In fact thanks to Santana giving the Devil Rays such great batting practice they have been on fire since facing him.
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Postby bboy » Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:59 pm

New Zealand Fan wrote:His last four starts before interleague play he lost in a row to Tampa Bay, Kansas City, White Sox and Toronto. In fact thanks to Santana giving the Devil Rays such great batting practice they have been on fire since facing him.


True he did have a bad stretch but his numbers in the last 3 games are spectacular no matter who the hell you're playing, interleague or not.

He has been badly burnt in a couple of outings (Oak and Chi) but amongst that has shown enough to be considered, maybe not a stud, but at least a top tier pitcher.
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Postby kcs261 » Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:07 pm

I think it's Tom Foolery for people to argue that his off-season elbow surgery didn't have an effect on him at the start of the season. Fact is, Santana is a stud you have to play every week -- unless your pitching depth is just ungodly and you are deciding between another stud and Santana.
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Postby NZF » Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:10 pm

bboy wrote:
New Zealand Fan wrote:His last four starts before interleague play he lost in a row to Tampa Bay, Kansas City, White Sox and Toronto. In fact thanks to Santana giving the Devil Rays such great batting practice they have been on fire since facing him.


True he did have a bad stretch but his numbers in the last 3 games are spectacular no matter who the hell you're playing, interleague or not.

He has been badly burnt in a couple of outings (Oak and Chi) but amongst that has shown enough to be considered, maybe not a stud, but at least a top tier pitcher.



Kansas City and Toronto hit him pretty hard as well in late May and they are seriously ordinary offensive teams. Let's see what happens when he goes back to his own division before we put him in top tier pitcher class.
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Postby Zito is God » Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:38 pm

I'm getting so sick and tired of all this "Wheres ZIG now that Santana has a good start, he just disappears, hahaha". Do you expect me to be online every second. So far EVERY start Santana had that was good , I was there to admit it. I ALSO admit that he had good starts against horrid offenses. As it was stated before, lest see what he does vs the yankees...
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Postby thehat » Sun Jun 20, 2004 8:11 pm

The guy was 12-3, 3.07 last year, 8-6, 2.99 the year before. He started 32 games over those two years.

20-9, 3.05 for the two years. 266 IP, 211 H, 96 BB, 306 K's (!)

He went 20 consecutive STARTS without losing a single decision.

His rough start was likely a result of the strained forearm that he had thru spring training, plus perhaps putting too much heat on himself looking to be perfect in his first go-round as a #1 starter.

I'm amazed there's even a mild debate about his credentials at this point. Some of you guys act as though he's some raw rookie, writing about waiting to see about when he faces good competition. HUH? Who was he facing the last two seasons?
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Postby kcs261 » Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:21 pm

I'm amazed there's even a mild debate about his credentials at this point. Some of you guys act as though he's some raw rookie, writing about waiting to see about when he faces good competition. HUH? Who was he facing the last two seasons?


Amen to that! Santana has been outstanding the past few seasons. But he got off to a rough start this season after pre-season elbow surgery, and people want to act like he's unproven. That's BS. Santana is a stud SP, plain and simple.
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Postby Rohan » Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:47 pm

true, he does not have an era of a stud, but as of today, he is a stud. After scraping bone off your elbow, to remove bone spurs, you try pitching like a stud. It took him until now to have solid performances. He should be pretty solid the rest of the season...

but to be honest, i'm not starting him against the Sox
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