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BALCO admits giving steroids...

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Postby BabyBoomer » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:00 pm

If it is true then they might go to jail for because they said they didn't take it in a court of law. Thats breaking the law

I am noit sure of it though
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Postby jayman » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:04 pm

BabyBoomer wrote:If it is true then they might go to jail for because they said they didn't take it in a court of law. Thats breaking the law

I am noit sure of it though


These nits are all going to claim they didn't know they were taking it. It is the perfect excuse. "They told me it was vitamins, how the hell am I suppose to know." Then again, ignorance is not an excuse in criminal court.
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Postby cardinals15 » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:27 pm

I've been reading some of the posts and have little knowledge about the background. It seems like we have a lot of vague conclusions of the whole balco and steroids investigation. To clarify though, is there an attorney or somebody who actually knows the issues involved that can answer clarify a few things?

a. Is taking the specific Steroids that balco apparently was providing to these athletes actually against the law and punishable with a prison term? And at what point in time was it deemed against the law?

A lot of Olympic athletes get banned, or dq'd for testing positive. But none of these guys gets thrown in jail or anything. Is this Balco investigation actually the feds or drug enforcement agency going after Balco for illegal drugs, or was it spawned by tax evasion or something else and all this other information is getting dragged out there.

b. I can conclude that MLB, like the olympics, has a rule against Steroids. When was it enacted?

My own internal conclusion on steroids, is it is equivalent to corking a bat so to speak in that it provides an unfair advantage and deserves a penalty as such, but it doesn't ruin the game in my opinion, the sky isn't falling. They are working to get a mechanism to catch people who are using them, and punish them. LIke the bat corkers, like the grease ball throwers etc.

Its a complex issue for sure, but to compare it to gambling is going too far. Players and coaches gambling on their own sport can be absolutely destructive to public faith and the real time drama that sports creates. It killed the Tiawanese baseball league years back and almost did the same to the MLB back in the Black sox's days.

Basically if Bonds is on steroids, you can still enjoy the world series as the outcome is uncertain. If Bonds and other Sf players are betting against his own team, well, I think we are all being duped into watching a fixed professional wrestling match. People in vegas and all over the world are losing money on a scam event. In professional wresting terms its pandamoniem!
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Postby wrveres » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:31 pm

Amazinz wrote:There were two newspapers: San Fransisco Chronicle & San Jose Mercury news.


the story was supposedly broken by Mr. Williams of the Chronicle. Actually every couple of weeks ... he "Re Breaks" the story ..


march5th, Mr williams again wrote:A Chronicle report saying the athletes received steroids and in Bonds' case human growth hormone from the Bay Area Laboratory Co-Operative was based on government memos that recount investigators' interviews with BALCO owner Victor Conte and Vice President James Valente, lawyers Robert Holley and Troy Ellerman said at a press conference here


sound familar? hmm... but it was a month and a half ago... so every couple of weeks this same reporter comes up with the same story? and you all fall in line like sheep ... ;-)
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Postby CubsFan7724 » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:39 pm

Heres your proof right here: No man who is older than 35 can hit 73 homers without enhancements. No one. Its ridiculous. If he wasnt getting all these walks he would be hitting high 60s 70s every year. When hes nearly 40. Come on.
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Postby Nomar4prez » Mon Apr 26, 2004 6:43 pm

jeffc_76 wrote:
Bukoski77 wrote:Also getting a little off baseball talk, the beauty of our law is that it can be changed. I support sports attempting to ban and test for them but feel steroids should be decriminalized.


Agree 100%. People should have the right to decide for themselves if they want to take a chance with steroids. Steroids only get bad press but it is entirely possible that there may be safe levels to take especially if it was done under the guidance of a doctor. I've checked into andro and other prohormones (prosteroids) which are currently legal and anyone who takes steroids will tell you that they can give you the same side effects as real steroids but probably with less gains. So, we currently allow the sale of things that are arguably equally dangerous and less effective to steroids. Not consistent.

But to be fair, public funds shouldn't be used to treat someone if his testicles shrivel up or he grows breats. Then again, public funds shouldn't be used when someone is dying of lung cancer, emphysema, or liver disease after abusing their bodies in other ways.


People shouldn't have the right to decide if they want to take steroids. Most of the people who would take them, wouldn't look into the pros and cons of steriods, and would, most likely, abuse them. AND, with 'roid rage, that puts other people at risk. Is it fair to a child if their father dies at an early age due to steroid abuse? Some choices in life should be made for people.
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Postby wrveres » Mon Apr 26, 2004 7:09 pm

CubsFan7724 wrote:Heres your proof right here: No man who is older than 35 can hit 73 homers without enhancements. No one. Its ridiculous. If he wasnt getting all these walks he would be hitting high 60s 70s every year. When hes nearly 40. Come on.


but you automatically assume those "enhancements" are illegal or are steriods. I could walk into GNC today and buy 100-150 different legal "enhancements" that would help me during my work out. So how is that Proof? :-?
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Postby wrveres » Mon Apr 26, 2004 7:16 pm

Nomar4prez wrote: Some choices in life should be made for people.


gotta be a Democrat or a Socialist. Actually there are both pretty close in there thinking. Closer than most people think.
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Postby jeffc_76 » Mon Apr 26, 2004 7:22 pm

Nomar4prez wrote:People shouldn't have the right to decide if they want to take steroids. Most of the people who would take them, wouldn't look into the pros and cons of steriods, and would, most likely, abuse them. AND, with 'roid rage, that puts other people at risk. Is it fair to a child if their father dies at an early age due to steroid abuse? Some choices in life should be made for people.


If it was by prescription, not OTC, the person would have to consult a doctor before taking them and be educated about the pros/cons. I'm not a doctor but I'm inclined to believe that a small enough amount with medical guidance would not necessarily result in abuse. It's not a black and white issue but as I was saying andro's legal and it can induce all the same side effects. Just to play devil's advocate, is it fair to a child if their father dies of lung cancer from smoking cigarettes? It just rubs me the wrong way a little bit that people who use steroids to try to improve themselves are categorized the same as people who take drugs to destroy themselves. btw, in case you were starting to think I did, I have never taken steroids nor do I plan to. I did take a form of andro for a little while, however.
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Postby Bukoski77 » Mon Apr 26, 2004 7:27 pm

Nomar4prez wrote:
jeffc_76 wrote:
Bukoski77 wrote:Also getting a little off baseball talk, the beauty of our law is that it can be changed. I support sports attempting to ban and test for them but feel steroids should be decriminalized.


Agree 100%. People should have the right to decide for themselves if they want to take a chance with steroids. Steroids only get bad press but it is entirely possible that there may be safe levels to take especially if it was done under the guidance of a doctor. I've checked into andro and other prohormones (prosteroids) which are currently legal and anyone who takes steroids will tell you that they can give you the same side effects as real steroids but probably with less gains. So, we currently allow the sale of things that are arguably equally dangerous and less effective to steroids. Not consistent.

But to be fair, public funds shouldn't be used to treat someone if his testicles shrivel up or he grows breats. Then again, public funds shouldn't be used when someone is dying of lung cancer, emphysema, or liver disease after abusing their bodies in other ways.


People shouldn't have the right to decide if they want to take steroids. Most of the people who would take them, wouldn't look into the pros and cons of steriods, and would, most likely, abuse them. AND, with 'roid rage, that puts other people at risk. Is it fair to a child if their father dies at an early age due to steroid abuse? Some choices in life should be made for people.



Its not fair to the child at all. It also isnt fair to a child when there father dies of cancer from smokeing or liver failure from drinking. There is no perfect answer but I believe it is that persons right to decide for themself. I dont believe in a "free" country that I have the right to make that decision for them or them for me. We are getting knee deep in semantics now. I will wager anything that roid related deaths will never rival Tobacco, alcohal, and drum roll..............ASPRIN. Check out the statistics on asprin related over doses and attempted suicide. I dont neccesarily advocate it in regards to steroids, but will stand behind free choice. Or we could just take the federal governments say out of it and make it a states rights issue. Then we as free people could move to a state that allowed it or not depending on our preference.
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