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BALCO admits giving steroids...

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Postby Bukoski77 » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:44 pm

ajgdrummer7 wrote:
Bukoski77 wrote:I dont believe there should be an * bye any records, as has been stated steroids werent against baseball's rules until recently. I know alot of people have an its "agaisnt the law, so its cheating in baseball......." take on it. Baseball is played primarily in the U.S. but draws its talent from the entire world. In many countries where players come from steroids arent illegal, and if they werent illegal in baseball, its kind of hard to point the moral finger. I can gamble all I want 12.5 miles off U.S. water in a boat and the government has no problem with it.

Finally I say there should be no *'s simply because if you dont think MLB as a whole ignored the steroid use for the last 10 years you are just refuseing to face reality. I admit I dont have a smokeing gun that proves several high ups in the MLB community were aware of it, but I have common sense. Baseball could have put their foot down years ago and attempted to regulate it just like the NFL does. It wouldnt have stop it but it could have kept the record books a little cleaner when players got caught years later. Baseball as a whole chose to ignore it, now the records and #'s should stand.


Decent point except for the fact that Bonds, Giambi and Sheffield are all American.

Giambi is jacked and looks like a monster but I don't feel that he's guilty as much as I do for Bonds. Giambi doesn't hit 70 homeruns or just put on ridiculous displays as Bonds has. Giambi isn't over 35 and still crushing the ball with each swing. Giambi is in his early 30's and hitting just around 40 homeruns. The same is done by Jim Thome, Richie Sexson, Brian Giles, Lance Berkman, and many, MANY more.

Maybe I'm a little partial to Giambi but it doesn't seem like he's that guilty to me.



Thanks dude. I was trying to leave any specific players off the name list, more just arguing all records as a whole should stand. But in regards to those three being Americans, I have smoked marijuana in Mexico and Amsterdam, it was legal. Where getting a little too hypothetical.............but if they did their roids off shore?
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Postby Amazinz » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:44 pm

hybrid wrote:hmmm ... "Bonds' trainer, Greg Anderson, brought Bonds and several other baseball players to BALCO to obtain drugs at the beginning of the 2003 season."

he hit 73 in 2001 and 46 in 2002, now you don't have to be great at math to figure out that something doesn't add up :-?

so he gets 'roids in 2003 and his hr total goes down from the previos 2 years?


Only if you assume 2003 was the first year he took steroids. Most people who aren't in denial believe it was earlier than that.
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Postby hybrid » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:46 pm

Amazinz wrote:
hybrid wrote:hmmm ... "Bonds' trainer, Greg Anderson, brought Bonds and several other baseball players to BALCO to obtain drugs at the beginning of the 2003 season."

he hit 73 in 2001 and 46 in 2002, now you don't have to be great at math to figure out that something doesn't add up :-?

so he gets 'roids in 2003 and his hr total goes down from the previos 2 years?


Only if you assume 2003 was the first year he took steroids. Most people who aren't in denial believe it was earlier than that.


i'm just saying that is the first time it says they ever gave him any, so something doesn't make sense.
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Postby jayman » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:47 pm

Amazinz wrote:
hybrid wrote:hmmm ... "Bonds' trainer, Greg Anderson, brought Bonds and several other baseball players to BALCO to obtain drugs at the beginning of the 2003 season."

he hit 73 in 2001 and 46 in 2002, now you don't have to be great at math to figure out that something doesn't add up :-?

so he gets 'roids in 2003 and his hr total goes down from the previos 2 years?


Only if you assume 2003 was the first year he took steroids. Most people who aren't in denial believe it was earlier than that.


If you use the style of arguments Barry and his boys use:

The statement says Anderson "brought" players to BALCO. You don't have to be "brought" to BALCO to get drugs from BALCO. There is something called "mail".
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Postby eftda » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:49 pm

Just Remember that there are other player who took Roids. ;-)

If you said Bonds should be banned or a * should go next to his name means that every player who took drugs to help them play better should have the same thing. Maybe 40-50% of the players in the Majors have taken Roids...
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Postby jayman » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:52 pm

eftda wrote:Just Remember that there are other player who took Roids. ;-)

If you said Bonds should be banned or a * should go next to his name means that every player who took drugs to help them play better should have the same thing. Maybe 40-50% of the players in the Majors have taken Roids...


If Barry were taken hitting 100-130/30-50/100-130/300-340 I really wouldn't care that much. But, the man has the SINGLE SEASON HOME RUN record and he is going to have the CAREER HOME RUN RECORD. That just doesn't site right with me.
Last edited by jayman on Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tmoney » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:53 pm

ajgdrummer7 wrote:Giambi is jacked and looks like a monster but I don't feel that he's guilty as much as I do for Bonds. Giambi doesn't hit 70 homeruns or just put on ridiculous displays as Bonds has. Giambi isn't over 35 and still crushing the ball with each swing. Giambi is in his early 30's and hitting just around 40 homeruns. The same is done by Jim Thome, Richie Sexson, Brian Giles, Lance Berkman, and many, MANY more.

Maybe I'm a little partial to Giambi but it doesn't seem like he's that guilty to me.


So now Giambi is not guilty of steroids, he is only guilty of not being as good of a baseball player as Bonds? Just because Giambi is not capable of hitting 70+ homeruns because of his talent, does not mean he is less guilty. He is just as guilty as the others if proven, it is just not as much of a dramatic case to talk about as it is with Bonds.
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Postby hybrid » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:53 pm

jayman wrote:If you use the style of arguments Barry and his boys use:

The statement says Anderson "brought" players to BALCO. You don't have to be "brought" to BALCO to get drugs from BALCO. There is something called "mail".


very true, but why if you were using it for 2 or so plus years would you go in then? bonds doesn't strike me as the type to go in and be "hey what's up (insert owners name), got any new 'roids for me? sweet." not saying bonds or anyone didn't use anything, just something doesn't make sense.
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Postby Amazinz » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:55 pm

eftda wrote:Just Remember that there are other player who took Roids. ;-)

If you said Bonds should be banned or a * should go next to his name means that every player who took drugs to help them play better should have the same thing. Maybe 40-50% of the players in the Majors have taken Roids...


This is a fair point but until everything is resolved Bonds will be the poster child because of his success.
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Postby jayman » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:55 pm

hybrid wrote:
jayman wrote:If you use the style of arguments Barry and his boys use:

The statement says Anderson "brought" players to BALCO. You don't have to be "brought" to BALCO to get drugs from BALCO. There is something called "mail".


very true, but why if you were using it for 2 or so plus years would you go in then? bonds doesn't strike me as the type to go in and be "hey what's up (insert owners name), got any new 'roids for me? sweet." not saying bonds or anyone didn't use anything, just something doesn't make sense.


Hehe... he went to thank them and shake their hands for helping him break the single season home run record. The others were there to be convinced to use the drugs (theory).

Anyone know what these guys paid for this stuff? I mean if it turns a 35-45 HR hitter into a 73 HR hitter it's gotta be worth a ton of cash.
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