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Questions for Bonds haters

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Postby ramble2 » Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:48 pm

For your consideration.

As most people know, Bonds has opted out of the MLBPA licensing agreement. He took a lot of heat over this for being greedy.

What is less publicized is that Bonds has arranged that half the revenue from sale of Bonds paraphenalia related to hitting #660 goes to Willie Mays. It's his way of sharing with an old-timer who didn't get the share of the game proceeds that today's players get. That's a pretty cool and classy move on Bonds' part.

Unfortunately, I don't have any link to a story verifying this. It's what I heard when I went to the Giants game over the weekend. If anyone can verify it, it'd be appreciated. Unfortunately, it's unlikely that sportswriters will write about this.

As for the following:

JamesBond007 wrote:i still won't respect him like the players who played the game back when the game was pure


I don't even know what the heck this is supposed to mean - except that it comes across as very ignorant. Today's players are the most diverse and talented ever. And baseball has always had an unseemly side to it. People complain about how pampered today's players are, but seem to ignore how exploited players used to be.

It's easier to simply romanticize and idealize the past, instead of appreciating how great the game is today. We are living in another golden age of baseball, with some of the greatest to ever play the game. There will always be jerks in the game, and also great guys. Just watch the joy that Vlad Guerrero brings to the game to appreciate this.
"The game has a cleanness. If you do a good job, the numbers say so. You don't have to ask anyone or play politics. You don't have to wait for the reviews." - Sandy Koufax
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Postby thetongueofire » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:05 pm

i dont really give a @$!$%!@$# about Barry Bonds... even if he did take steroids, he was one of the many major leagures to do so... why should i dislike him any more than all those other players... on a personal level he kinda comes across as arrogant but thats not what i care about
[size=10]Manny Ramirez....$20 million
Pedro Martinez....$17.5 million
Curt Schilling...$12 million (and a $2 million bonus)
Never hearing a Yankee fan chant 1918 again...priceless. [/size]
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Postby gregdub » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:14 pm

Bonds is a great player...to what extent steroids played on his numbers no one will ever know. I agree that steroids doesn't make you a great hitter, but how can it not make a difference with someone who has great batting skills already? People get all hot and bothered and defend Bonds saying he still has to make contact, see the ball, etc. Imagine if a guy like George Brett bulked up...he already had excellent hitting skills and could add extra power. IMO, great hitters who add strength will have all those balls hit to the deep outfield/warning track go over the fence. Maybe 10-15 hr's, i don't know, just a guess. You also have to figure most of those count as hits that would most likely be outs...average will go up as well.
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Postby JamesBond007 » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:17 pm

ramble2 wrote:As for the following:

JamesBond007 wrote:i still won't respect him like the players who played the game back when the game was pure


how pampered today's players are, but seem to ignore how exploited players used to be.

.


Well, thanks for taking a shot at me, Bonds would be proud.

Players exploited? i've never seen anyone forced into playing Major League Baseball. If they weren't being treated fairly playing a game for a living, they could always get a real job.

Sorry for having an opinion you don't agree with....
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Postby JamesBond007 » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:20 pm

Why are guests still allowed to post here? :-t
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Postby jeffc_76 » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:21 pm

I don't think it's a sure thing though. Look at Canseco. He was a better, more complete, player before he got unnaturally huge. For those of you that follow the NFL, imo WR David Boston is on some sort of juice because he has gotten ridiculously big in recent years and now he's constantly getting injured. I think you can probably take the "right" amound of the "right" steroids and get gains without problems but for every player that's done that, there's probably been another that it didn't work out for.
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Postby BobbyRoberto » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:21 pm

Does "Guest" ever have anything sensible to contribute in a discussion, or is "Guest" always an ignorant jerk?
Roger Angell: I was talking with Bob Gibson and I said: 'Are you always this competitive?' He said: 'Oh, I think so. I got a three-year old daughter, and I've played about 500 games of tic-tac-toe with her and she hasn't beat me yet.'
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Postby Bedard » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:24 pm

Ah, the comedy. I'll rephrase my response. He's strong. He lifts. You're not as strong. Other players aren't as strong. Deal with it.
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Postby blankman » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:28 pm

mtarail wrote:
blankman wrote: It is nearly impossible to compare today's numbers to today's given all of the changes in the game. IMO Ruth is still by far the better player. Compare his numbers to his contemporaries for evidence. He outhomered WHOLE TEAMS in his day, not to mention he could have been a HOF pitcher had he continued to pitch.

just my 2 cents


Isn't this a little hippocritical? You say it's impossible to compare era's and then bring in a bunch of stats from another era to show that Babe is better? LOL.


yes it is a bit hypocrtical (spelled with a Y) and I realized that after I wrote it, but was too lazy to fix it. !+)

But, I did not actually bring in "a bunch of stats" as you say. I was merely saying that you can compare players to their contemporaries in order to attempt to compare two players from different eras. What I think I meant, lol, was that you cannot simply take numbers from different eras and directly compare them. (ie you cannot compare Ruth's 60 HR directly with Bonds' 73 HR and say that Bonds is better, nor will be the case when Bonds passes Ruth in career HR).

One question though, when did they start awarding Gold Gloves?
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Postby LetsPlay2 » Sun Apr 18, 2004 11:34 pm

I disliked Bonds back in the early 90's because I'm a Braves fan and he played for the Pirates (I actually should have loved him for his playoff futility back then). Now I dislike Bonds because of the way he carries himself due to his superiority complex. He's still an awesome hitter no matter what he did or did not take.

"And if it does happen, the only number I care about is Babe Ruth's. Because as a left-handed hitter, I wiped him out."

And if you think for a second that I think "left-handed" really meant "left-handed" you'd be mistaken.
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