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Sloppy Loaiza 2-0

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Postby LBJackal » Tue Apr 13, 2004 6:54 pm

I agree he'll need good run support to win 20, but most, if not all pitchers do as well. I disagree that his past stats have anything more than a slight effect on how he'll do this year. He's a totally different pitcher than he was before last year. He added a very effective cutter and splitter. His pre-2003 aren't very meaningful at all. Once he regains his control you'll all see it was no fluke last year...and I know nobody will believe me, so please dont' bring out all his Rangers and Blue Jays stats to show me how bad he was. I live in Toronto, I got to see it first hand.
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Postby Madison » Wed Apr 14, 2004 1:14 am

ramble2 wrote:
LBJackal wrote:I'm a believer still. He had a rough start, with a bad WHIP and his K's weren't what you'd expect. Being 2-0 doesn't mean much, but it's nice to see he's getting run support. Once he regains his control (meaning less walks, more K's, lower WHIP, less HR's, all essentailly leading to a lower ERA and more wins), I think he'll have around a 1.25 WHIP, 200+ K's, and 20 wins aren't out of the question. I was prediting a more modest number like 15-17, but with the way he's pitched so far and still managing to win both starts, I don't see 20 as improbable.


:-?

So let me get this straight, you think it's a good sign that he won despite getting rocked today? Call me crazy, but if he keeps pitching poorly I would expect him to lose more often than win. If you are counting on 7-8 runs per game to get Loaiza his 20 wins that's stretching it. I wouldn't count on more than 15 wins, tops.

And for the record, the bad WHIP is just what I expect of him this season, as I expect him to revert back to his norm. ERA > 4.25; WHIP > 1.3. If I'm wrong, I'm happy to eat crow.


Where have you been all offseason Ramble? :-D

I've said 4+ era with 12 wins all offseason and more than a few people think I'm crazy.

So far the wins don't look good for me, but they are not worth the era/whip damage so far. ;-)
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Postby ramble2 » Wed Apr 14, 2004 12:00 pm

Madison wrote:
ramble2 wrote:
LBJackal wrote:I'm a believer still. He had a rough start, with a bad WHIP and his K's weren't what you'd expect. Being 2-0 doesn't mean much, but it's nice to see he's getting run support. Once he regains his control (meaning less walks, more K's, lower WHIP, less HR's, all essentailly leading to a lower ERA and more wins), I think he'll have around a 1.25 WHIP, 200+ K's, and 20 wins aren't out of the question. I was prediting a more modest number like 15-17, but with the way he's pitched so far and still managing to win both starts, I don't see 20 as improbable.


:-?

So let me get this straight, you think it's a good sign that he won despite getting rocked today? Call me crazy, but if he keeps pitching poorly I would expect him to lose more often than win. If you are counting on 7-8 runs per game to get Loaiza his 20 wins that's stretching it. I wouldn't count on more than 15 wins, tops.

And for the record, the bad WHIP is just what I expect of him this season, as I expect him to revert back to his norm. ERA > 4.25; WHIP > 1.3. If I'm wrong, I'm happy to eat crow.


Where have you been all offseason Ramble? :-D

I've said 4+ era with 12 wins all offseason and more than a few people think I'm crazy.

So far the wins don't look good for me, but they are not worth the era/whip damage so far. ;-)


Oh I'm with you on this one! I'll happily share the crow pie with you if he proves us wrong, but I'm pretty confident we'll be the ones dishing it out!

LBJackal, I will give you a ton of credit for one thing: you actually saw Loaiza pitch in Toronto and are still on board the L-Train. That's impressive!
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Postby Guest » Wed Apr 14, 2004 12:06 pm

His past seasons (the bad ones) mean nothing. Hes obviously improved his mechanics, added some pitches, and he looked dominant last year. Why cant he repeat that? If someone shows what they can do (Esteban last year), why does everyone jump to conclussions that it was a fluke. When/If a rookie were to come in and bang out 30 homeruns (mark teixera) he gets lots of repect, and hes going to keep improving. Now I realize Loaiza is no rookie, but if he did it last year, he can do it again! Take some examples: Javy Lopez, David Ortiz! Had carreer years, and look how they are starting this year - they look like they'll pull a repeater of last year!
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Postby Madison » Wed Apr 14, 2004 12:47 pm

ramble2 wrote:Oh I'm with you on this one! I'll happily share the crow pie with you if he proves us wrong, but I'm pretty confident we'll be the ones dishing it out!


Same here! ;-D
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Yes doctor, there will be blood.....
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