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Canada Mexico Fight

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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby silverZ » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:58 pm

thedude wrote:
BJSFAN123 wrote:
silverZ wrote:It's glorified spring training. Enjoy it for what it is. If managers didn't agree to get everyone at bats and have pitchers on strict pitch counts there would be even less talent coming from MLB.


That's the other thing, the tournament is at an awful time..you have hitters still getting their timing down and pitchers just getting back in the groove of things. You're seeing the best players when they aren't at their best.



No one treats this like spring training. There are pitch counts, but the batters usually play an entire game. You see substitutions occasionally, but not the mass exodus like in ST games. Pitchers concentrate on trying to get hitters out instead of just throwing fastballs or trying out new pitches. Players actually play to win the games.


Hence the "glorified" spring training. Sure, the players care and nationalism is a powerful motivator, but the MLB/NPB casts a shadow over every decision made by team USA. If no country is putting it's full force behind winning you can never expect it to be taken seriously as the World Cup or the Olympics.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby k.k. » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:43 pm

Skin Blues wrote:
It's also pretty amazing how easy it is to get a grown man to act like a 9 year old. Congrats Luis Cruz, way to defend your "honour". Not only did your team get eliminated, but you embarassed your country in the process.


I'd certainly agree with that. Runs Differential, Mexico. Learn about it.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby kab21 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:11 pm

I think people need to accept it for what it is. There have been some great games this year but it's still definitely second fiddle to the WS. tbh - I think I like it more than the WS. Most of the time there are a couple of teams that I don't really care about in it and I'm usually baseball'd out after a 6 month season.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby J35J » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:12 am

kab21 wrote:I think people need to accept it for what it is.


This is where people disagree I think. What "is it" exactly? Everyone here likely watches it and roots for their country...but how tied up do you get in the outcome? I watch it and root for the US, but I'd get more excited for wins in April for the Royals than the outcome of these WBC games. I feel like I can only match how invested the players or the "potential player pool" is...the US really isn't all that invested in this so I find it hard to be all that invested in the outcomes.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby kab21 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:16 am

Braun
Wright
Mauer
Phillips
Stanton
Jones
Gio
Dickey
Kimbrel

Not invested at all...

I actually watch it because I'm rooting for the underdogs (netherlands and Taiwan were awesome). I like seeing the prospects that get pressed into action by some countries that lack depth. I like seeing the Cuban, Japanese and Korean players that rarely ever end up on TV (even in Taiwan).

Do you disagree that it's second fiddle to the world series? Or are you suggesting that it's second fiddle to spring training games? If you think this is second fiddle to spring training games then you haven't been watching. There have been some great games with stadiums packed with noisy fans. I've watched a few spring training games and they have been boring.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby Ender » Wed Mar 13, 2013 11:33 am

J35J wrote:
kab21 wrote:I think people need to accept it for what it is.


This is where people disagree I think. What "is it" exactly? Everyone here likely watches it and roots for their country...but how tied up do you get in the outcome? I watch it and root for the US, but I'd get more excited for wins in April for the Royals than the outcome of these WBC games. I feel like I can only match how invested the players or the "potential player pool" is...the US really isn't all that invested in this so I find it hard to be all that invested in the outcomes.



I'm more invested than you are. I'm more into the US games than I will be for Brewer games in April. Not as much into it as I will be if the Brewers pitching holds up and they are playing for the playoffs late season though. I find the USA games more exciting than the putrid World Series we got this year though for sure. I haven't been able to get into the Japan/Cuba games as much since I just don't know any of the players, same reason I don't watch much minor league or college baseball. Baseball really loses a lot for me at least when I don't have a connection to the players in some fashion.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby J35J » Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:00 pm

kab21 wrote:Braun
Wright
Mauer
Phillips
Stanton
Jones
Gio
Dickey
Kimbrel

Not invested at all...

I actually watch it because I'm rooting for the underdogs (netherlands and Taiwan were awesome). I like seeing the prospects that get pressed into action by some countries that lack depth. I like seeing the Cuban, Japanese and Korean players that rarely ever end up on TV (even in Taiwan).

Do you disagree that it's second fiddle to the world series? Or are you suggesting that it's second fiddle to spring training games? If you think this is second fiddle to spring training games then you haven't been watching. There have been some great games with stadiums packed with noisy fans. I've watched a few spring training games and they have been boring.


I can probably cite off a better option over just about every player you listed above, and it's already been beat to death the SP that didn't show. I also never said the players that actually did show up weren't invested, they showed, good for them, glad someone did and I'm sure they are excited and want to kick butt, that's not my issue. We need to have the best of the best out there, and our bench should also be the best of the best. To me this is second fiddle to pretty much everything else that mattters(world series, regular season)....spring training doesn't matter.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby kab21 » Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:29 pm

Is it better to have the best possible 'team' of players or the best names?

Imo even if they had the best names on the roster it would still be considered a second rate tournament. Even Olympics basketball is still second to the NBA finals although it is closer and there are notable omissions on that roster also.
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby J35J » Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:50 pm

kab21 wrote:Is it better to have the best possible 'team' of players or the best names?

Imo even if they had the best names on the roster it would still be considered a second rate tournament. Even Olympics basketball is still second to the NBA finals although it is closer and there are notable omissions on that roster also.


Well who knows what the best team may end up being...might be worth a try to have the best players out there though, and have them want to be out there not forced too. And you are right, it may always be a second rate tourny, but it certainly is if the best players aren't playing. IMHO.

To make even more legit, lets shrink the regular season down to like 145 games, then make a 2 week All-Star break where this tourny is played. That way you have everyone's arms in mid season shape and all the hitters have their timing down, etc. Now that would be fun!! :-)
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Re: Canada Mexico Fight

Postby jeffmerk » Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:33 pm

J35J wrote:
kab21 wrote:Is it better to have the best possible 'team' of players or the best names?

Imo even if they had the best names on the roster it would still be considered a second rate tournament. Even Olympics basketball is still second to the NBA finals although it is closer and there are notable omissions on that roster also.


Well who knows what the best team may end up being...might be worth a try to have the best players out there though, and have them want to be out there not forced too. And you are right, it may always be a second rate tourny, but it certainly is if the best players aren't playing. IMHO.

To make even more legit, lets shrink the regular season down to like 145 games, then make a 2 week All-Star break where this tourny is played. That way you have everyone's arms in mid season shape and all the hitters have their timing down, etc. Now that would be fun!! :-)

It would be fun but it will probably never happen. In the mean time, I get enough enjoyment out of seeing how Caribbean and Asian fans make much more of an event out of a ballgame than we do.
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