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10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby RyeWhiskey » Fri Oct 19, 2012 1:45 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:If you want names the All-Star game is in July. The best moments of the playoffs so far this year have been provided by Pete Kozma and Raul Ibanez. The best moments of last year was provided by David Freese. The Cardinals trying to go back to back with no Pujols and no LaRussa would be a huge story. Verlander and the Tigers returning to the WS to try and redeem the 2006 should be a huge story. The teams might have been here before but there are plenty of established stars that would be playing for thier first ring. Interesting baseball is all that matters not the media stories. I don't remember too many people being exciting about last year's matchup and it was fantastic.


I agree. Sounds like a bunch of people are looking for Home Run Derby Version 2. If you have ADD and need some instant gratification you can watch the red zone channel on Sunday - all scoring all day. Don't even need to watch the game itself.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby lane_anasazi2 » Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:35 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:If you want names the All-Star game is in July. The best moments of the playoffs so far this year have been provided by Pete Kozma and Raul Ibanez. The best moments of last year was provided by David Freese. The Cardinals trying to go back to back with no Pujols and no LaRussa would be a huge story. Verlander and the Tigers returning to the WS to try and redeem the 2006 should be a huge story. The teams might have been here before but there are plenty of established stars that would be playing for thier first ring. Interesting baseball is all that matters not the media stories. I don't remember too many people being exciting about last year's matchup and it was fantastic.


I know, right? That's kind of the problem. Interesting baseball is all well and good, but it can happen during the regular season. I can watch a good game any time, there's a possibility for good baseball to be played in May. The playoffs are about narrative, about story, at least to the vast majority of baseball fans who aren't diehard Cards//Tigers fans. And the truth is, a Cards/Tigers WS is a pretty damn boring story. Oakland, Baltimore, Washington... those were the exciting teams. A Giants/Athletics WS would have been interesting. A Nationals/NYY or Nationals/Anyone, really would have been exciting.

I'm a pretty big fan of baseball in general. I can, and have watched games between two teams I don't really care about and not talked for hours, and been entertained, because it was a good game. But that level of entertainment is a dry thing, and it pales compared to watching a game where I'm emotionally invested, where I care about the outcome. And I think that's very true for the vast majority of sports fans. And when my team hasn't sniffed the the playoffs for the better part of a decade, when the playoffs come around the first thing I want to see is a team I could get behind. I can get behind the Nationals because they're a great story... bad for so long, built from within, the right way, scrappy, colorful characters, a burgeoning superstar... I can get behind that, enough to care that they win. And that makes watching the games about 500% more fun.

The truth is, I couldn't care less who wins a potential Tigers/Cards WS. I'll watch it, and I'll root for good individual games, but it won't be nearly as fun. They're both well-put together teams who play fundamentally good baseball and get good all-around performances out of oh my god it's boring just talking about it.

Playoffs are about narrative.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby Pogotheostrich » Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:59 pm

If I want a good narrative I'll read a book. Most baseball narritives are false and hack stories anyway but if you want a narrative here are a few about the Tigers since they are already in it.

1. The Tigers owner Mike Ilitch is 82 years old and has taken the club from a baseball joke to perennial contender. He wants to win a world series before he dies. He splurged on Fielder before the season and almost everyone thought it was a bad idea (myself included). Now it doesn't look so bad.
2. The Tigers have the the 2011 and most likely 2012 MVP. Verlander and Cabrera might be the best pitcher and hitter in game respectively.
3. In 2006 the Tigers reached their first WS in 22 years. They looked young, played sloppy and lost to the Cardinals. Verlander in his first full season got pounded in his only WS start. it is 6 years later and Verlander and the Tigers are back.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby lane_anasazi2 » Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:58 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:If I want a good narrative I'll read a book.


You're really going to tell me you watch baseball purely for love of the, what, athletic skill and level of competition? Purity of the game? I have never met a baseball fan, ever, who watches baseball that way.

Pogotheostrich wrote:Most baseball narritives are false and hack stories anyway


"Most" is an exaggeration. Some are false and hackneyed, some aren't. And the ones that aren't become the basis for making games fun to watch as opposed to just watching a good game between two teams.

Pogotheostrich wrote:here are a few about the Tigers since they are already in it...


I'm not saying no one should care about who wins, I'm just trying to make you see why people who weren't already fans of those teams see it as a boring matchup. bigh0rt already said it..

bigh0rt wrote:The Cardinals don't have a single player on their team worth writing an article about that is interesting to anybody other than stat nerds, and the Tigers have Miguel Cabrera, who is far less interesting when he's not getting DUIs, Justin Verlander, who we can only talk about his 100 MPH fastball for so long, and Prince Fielder, who hasn't been interesting since everything about him referenced his 'estranged father'. It's a huge pile of boring. There's less charisma on those two teams combined than few other teams in the league. There's no 'story', nothing to root for if you're not invested in one of the teams already.


100% agreed. It's just "meh," been there done that. The Cards were a decent story last year, especially considering how they won, but they won - it's not like they're underdogs. And yes, Detroit went from a bad team to a perennial contender, but there's NOTHING more boring than a perennial contender. It's two well-built, fundamentally sound baseball teams full of solid contributors who are devoid of charisma. The best you can hope for is close games, late-innings drama, superb individual performances... all good things, but not exactly something I'm going to live and die by.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby mweir145 » Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:53 pm

This potential WS matchup isn't any worse than any WS matchup from the last decade. It's going to involve teams that aren't anywhere near the best in their respective leagues, but hey, that's the MLB playoffs for you. It seems people are only whining because it involves small markets that have had a lot of recent success. There's nothing new here to really talk about, but there really wasn't anything new to talk about last year and that turned out to be a fantastic series.


lane_anasazi2 wrote:You're really going to tell me you watch baseball purely for love of the, what, athletic skill and level of competition? Purity of the game? I have never met a baseball fan, ever, who watches baseball that way.

That is actually exactly why I watch baseball (and sports for that matter). It's why I'll sit through a 4 hour Yankees and Red Sox game (you know, when the Sox were actually good and not the sack of crap they are now), watch five-and-a-half hours of Djokovic and Nadal grinding through a tennis match in the final of a grand slam, or watch every one of Tiger Woods' rounds in majors. It certainly isn't because the teams I follow are any good or because those athletes/teams I mentioned are particularly likable. It's because I want to see the best athletes in the world compete at what they do on the highest level and on the grandest of stages.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby bigh0rt » Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:46 pm

I must be a weirdo cause I can't get jazzed up for Barry Zito vs. Lance Lynn.
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Re: Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby wrveres » Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:52 pm

bigh0rt wrote:I must be a weirdo cause I can't get jazzed up for Barry Zito vs. Lance Lynn.

Alcohol, Jergens Aloe Vera, and nakedness. I'm pumped.

Go Zito.



Oh wait you said "jazzed". My bad.

Nevermind.
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Re: Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby bigh0rt » Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:58 pm

wrveres wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:I must be a weirdo cause I can't get jazzed up for Barry Zito vs. Lance Lynn.

Alcohol, Jergens Aloe Vera, and nakedness. I'm pumped.

Go Zito.



Oh wait you said "jazzed". My bad.

Nevermind.
Here's the most interesting thing about a potential Tigers/Cardinals matchup. Tigers owner Mike Illitch looks like some Phil Spector/Frodo Baggins hybrid.

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Are we sure he's not really dead?? I wanna be this guy for Halloween.
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Re: Re: Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby wrveres » Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:01 pm

bigh0rt wrote:
wrveres wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:I must be a weirdo cause I can't get jazzed up for Barry Zito vs. Lance Lynn.

Alcohol, Jergens Aloe Vera, and nakedness. I'm pumped.

Go Zito.



Oh wait you said "jazzed". My bad.

Nevermind.
Here's the most interesting thing about a potential Tigers/Cardinals matchup. Tigers owner Mike Illitch looks like some Phil Spector/Frodo Baggins hybrid.

Image

Are we sure he's not really dead?? I wanna be this guy for Halloween.

That would be a great Halloween costume. I can't believe no one thought of it before.
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Re: 10/19 Cheering/Venting & is Zito God ??

Postby wrveres » Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:29 pm

It always amazes me how good Phat Ass is for such a chunky monkey. Nice snag.
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