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completed trades..vetoing

Postby malibuspeedrace » Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:49 am

In a full dynasty league...
I have completed 7 trades.
5 were with one squad.

I have pulled the better long term pieces...But now the league is polling to see if they need a league mandated 3 day veto period.
This will pass with flying colors for sure...I even voted yes to it.

After this poll is done, a new poll will be put up asking for all (or some...needs clarification for this) of my trades to be reversed, then put up for a league vote.


first trade
May 2nd
Sent Grant Balfour
received Matt Thornton, Mike Minor
-----------------------------------------
crappy all around trade. but shouldn't raise eyebrows

second trade
May 4th
Sent Jose Bautista, Jose Altuve & Gerardo Parra
received Ian Kinsler, Jesus Montero, Billy Butler & Michael Morse
--------------------------
many counters were done before we agreed to this. I was just trying to get out from under the struggeling Bautista before his value diminished.
shouldn't raise eyebrows

third trade
May 24th
Sent Hunter Pence, Fernando Rodney & James McDonald
received Stephen Strasburg, Austin Jackson & Colby Lewis
-------------------------------
the name Strasburg evidently made people question this deal...Other owner was called a moron according to the commish when stating this trade raised eyebrows. I am not sure if other owner is familiar with keeper leagues or not...All I did was counter several times & finally accepted this offer he sent. I would by no means call this a good trade for him...But I also don't think this should be vetoable...or whatever you will call what will be done by the end of the week when the trade will 90% become null & void..

fourth trade
May 25th
Sent Ian Desmond, Jemile Weeks & Brett Myers
received Elvis Andrus & Matt Joyce
------------------------------------
He sent a message saying pretty much this
I accepted the deal. Myers seems like a very good relief pitcher and Weeks should comer around sooner or later. Desmond is also a good replacement for Andrus. Good trade all around for both sides I'd say

while I don't really agree with his assessment...He seemed happy with the deal...& I just wanted a SS who isn't a streaky hitter that will kill my AVG for weeks at a time. Joyce wasn't a piece I was after. Should this really get overturned a week later...

fifth trade
June 2nd
Sent Carlos Ruiz
received Bryce Harper & Jose Altuve
-------------------------------------
this trade was just bad. this was when the league message was created...This offer came out of nowhere...And I rushed to accept before he could cancel.
Ruiz has been a stud all year...But In a dynasty league..Harper is on a tier all to himself. I had no desire to bring on Altuve, but also didn't want to miss a shot at Harper by doing a counter.


so now questions about us cheating or "red flags" have been thrown out there...they are pushing for all trades to be nixed & run through a league voting structure that has never been in existence before...& the one guy is very outspoken & will vote against all the deals more than likely..
I have no real way to prove I wasn't collaborating with the guy...other then all the proposed deals & counters that were offered & rejected for one reason or another...I sent all of these to the comish, & he said little to nothing...so I am not sure if it is just irrelevant to the situation or not..

the person seemed to be making a big deal of the fact that I have traded so many times with the same owner, & having 2 accepted trades on back to back days...when the truth is that since the strasburg deal, I had sent out over 20 trade proposals to 8 of the 9 other teams in the league..they get declined or time out...so no one sees them.

the other issue going against me is I know no one in this league, I have been in one previous league with the commish & he needed a replacement, so he asked me...But in the league Is the Commish's brother, His father, and I believe he mentioned it being a few friends or coworkers...not sure of all the other relationships...so he has lines of communication that have been used by them that aren't available to me..so I am sure I am getting trashed along with the other owner doing these trades. The new owner that I have traded with was also new to this league & in a different league I am in, but we did not know each other personally & have only been aware of each other since this baseball season started.

I admit that the last trade is bad, but all I did was hit accept...But this is going to be a total witch hunt in which I can do little to nothing it seems & will never be able to trade again with these people.
thoughts? suggestions?

EDIT
I would also like to add that the commish is just trying to handle the situation..He isn't trying to make rash decisions or anything of that nature. He even mentioned on at least one occasion he liked a deal for both sides, and about Stras, he was suprised he went for little...But that seemed like nothing more then a "nice move" type comment.
Last edited by malibuspeedrace on Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby mkultra » Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:11 pm

Trades 3-5 are pretty terrible, but as you say, he was the one who sent the offer on two of them. At any rate, this:

malibuspeedrace wrote:After this poll is done, a new poll will be put up asking for all (or some...needs clarification for this) of my trades to be reversed, then put up for a league vote.


is just full-stop ridiculous. The worst that can be said about you is that you kept going back to take advantage of a bad manager. While this is morally kinda weaselly, you didn't break any rules, and every other manager has had an opportunity to do the same. If your league feels they need to babysit trades via a waiting period, that's your business, but in no way is it acceptable to institute rules that take effect retroactively. That's just not done.

Also, beyond a basic "we're not in collusion" statement, I would not feel at all obligated to prove I was NOT colluding with someone. You don't owe anyone anything.
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby malibuspeedrace » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:00 pm

the owner that is outspoken has/was actually been in some trade talks with me

after the Ruiz deal I was left with only Victor Martinez with C elig..& I picked up Salvador Perez (5 DL spots..so they aren't killing me)

He has both Yadier Molina & A.J. Pierzynski...so I think, Hey, maybe I can get a C...maybe even cheaply since he has 2 quality ones.

offer a decently low offer to get some talk started..unkowingly with the person who has a big issue with my trades.
send - Ryan Zimmerman, Jose Altuve & Adam Wainwright
Receive - Yadier Molina & Cliff Lee

I am hoping for a low sell on Lee & high sell for Altuve....He just declines no comments..I think everything is cool.

I get a legit counter shortly after
send - Michael Young, Jose Altuve & Adam Wainwright
Receive - Yadier Molina & Cliff Lee

I really thought about this deal, But declined because I am trying to unload both, But the commish had shown interest in Young, So I had planned to offer him for an OF, or pair him for something (never got around to this portion with the crap hitting the fan though)

I say something similar with the decline

I then decide to throw the original offer to see if he would accept after hearing my reasoning...Now Altuve & Wainwright are deal breakers...head scratching a bit...

so I send a bit of a different counter to leave out an Ace. but including Zimmerman since he wasn't the deal breaker in the last offer.
Send - Ryan Zimmerman, Brandon McCarthy & Mike Minor
Receive - Yadier Molina & Alex Gordon

its not a great deal, but is it that awful compared to where we were and who he deemed to be deal breakers hours prior while asking for them in a deal just prior to..? its the same catcher & one of the most frustrating players in baseball instead of a top 5 ace that I could have had just prior too..
this is the message I get with the email.
i really hope this is a joke...after everything that is going on with trades too


my style is sending low to gauge the interest (I am sure many implement this same style) & to see if players are available, If the decline..ok, If they counter...sweet..If they accept..awesome...But this technique clearly aggravated him in this instance...& now as long as I remain in this league..which may be shorter then anticipated...I will have at least one team that will see I proposed a deal & decline out of the pure spite.
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby bigmck » Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:50 pm

I see you are new here. Just a "word from the wise". Keep those posts short if you want anyone to read them. I don't have time for a book. Thanks,
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby malibuspeedrace » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:16 pm

Thank you for this worth while input.

Short & sweet, yet dripping with deserved sarcasm.
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby mkultra » Wed Jun 06, 2012 4:44 pm

Guys, be nice.

I agree with bigmck that this thread is turning into a blow-by-blow account of your league drama that, honestly, no one is going to care about but you. This other manager's being a tool, we get it. How is that helping solve your problem?
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby Quackman » Fri Jun 08, 2012 3:21 pm

ya id make one last argument then its out of your hands. Honestly only trade 4 and 5 are really lopsided especially in a keeper. Getting andrus and harper is pretty crazy but id try and explain how it happened and they are basically bailing out idiot owners that made bad offers.
The 3rd trade i dont see how you think your ripping him off here. Mcdonald and Pence could be the best players in the deal. Strasburg is a bigger name but i could see Mcdonald having similier or better numbers this year than straburg.
At the very least they should not even think about reversing trades 1-3, id at least make that argument. Trade 4 and 5 are pretty freaking bad for keeper league, most leagues im in would veto those. Hell it might be better if they reverse 3 for ya,,your call.
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Re: completed trades..vetoing

Postby dannahann » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:11 pm

Whiny owners and dynasty leagues = trouble. With all the meddling in other people's trades, to the extent of reversing deals already done, could be a sign that your current league makeup isn't ready for a full dynasty. Maybe sort out the weaker owners (and the more whiny ones) and start over with trade # embargoes in place. If these deals get undone it is IMO ethically wrong for any of the assets in them to be available to any other owners.
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