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Expansion advice

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Expansion advice

Postby Ernie.Whitt. » Wed Jan 04, 2012 1:25 am

Hi all... and Happy New Years!

My keeper league just expanded from 10 teams to 12 teams. We use 40 man rosters (15 hitters active, 10 pitchers active, 15 man bench) and a $450 budget. Can anyone offer thoughts/experience on the impact of going from 10 to 12 teams? For example, are elite players even more critical, are certain positions now scarce when it would have been easy to fill them before etc...

For example, we START two catchers... so I imagine a top catcher, or even a decent one, is more valuable in a 12 team league over a 10 team. How much? I don't know... Maybe specialized guys for SB and SV will be more valuable as there are only so many guys who provide value in certain categories...

What do you think the biggest difference will be?

Many thanks for your insights!
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby lane_anasazi2 » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:12 am

That's a very broad topic, but in general the difference between 10 and 12 teams isn't huge. What you really need to do is look at tiered rankings and decide if there are big gaps starting around 10, 12, or 14+. It's an expansion draft, so that will complicate things, but look at it this way: In an 8 team league, 3B (one of the more shallow positions) isn't even that bad. After your Bautisa/Longoria/Beltre trio, you've got a big clump of 2nd tier guys including Aramis Ramirez, A-Rod, Wright, Sandoval, Youkilis, etc. But right around the 12th 3B taken you start to see a noticeable drop off. Chase Headly. David Freese. Martin Prado. Plugging one of those into your 3B spot for an entire season doesn't exactly give you a warm fuzzy feeling.

In deeper leagues, the value of that 2nd tier goes up because getting a 2nd tier 3B gives you a competitive advantage over a non-negligible portion of the league, unlike, say, an 8 team league where everyone's got at least a 2nd tier guy.

Moving from 10 to 12 though shouldn't be a huge deal. If you start 2 catchers, you're creating need for an additional 4 starters so the value of a top catcher will probably go up. The value of SS might go up as well since in a 10 team league there are juuuuust enough decent SS so that everyone has one. In a 12 team league someone's going to lose the game of musical chairs and end up starting Ian Desmond.

Honestly, the biggest difference is that as you add players it's simply more competitive. More managers mean you have to stay on top of things that much more because you're competing against a larger pool when it comes to trades and WW/FA pickups.

Hope that's been sort of helpful. If you had more specific questions or situations, I could probably say something more coherent.
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby bigh0rt » Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:05 am

lane_anasazi2 wrote:That's a very broad topic, but in general the difference between 10 and 12 teams isn't huge.

You're talking about going from a 400 player pool to a 480 player pool. The difference here is going to be much more severe than in your standard league.
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby Goatrider » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:21 pm

I only do league specific leagues, so this advice may be a little off but...

The biggest difference by far is during the auction process. The more teams you have, the more money to be spent. In a ten team league, you should see an infltion on top teired talent and deflation on players during the end game. Going to twelve teams, you should see a slight deflation on top-teir guys (ex: going from $45 to the $42 range) while inflating the values at the end (what you'd expect a $4 player to go in ten team league, be ready for a $7 price tag). Expect similarities in the mid-rounds. However, I always notice deflation in pitching during ten team leagues. So expect your pitching staff to be a little more difficult to put together. However, every auction is different.

The tier system the other guy suggested is a good place to start.
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby Ernie.Whitt. » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:42 pm

Thanks... Our league is actually not an auction. We have budgets (going from 10 teams at $500) to 12 teams at $450 and pre-generated player salaries based on how players performed in the past two years. The values of players are still calculated the same way (which requires a cap being reduced from $500 to $450. We each keep 15 players, so most of the top 100 players are already taken before the draft even begins. As a result, there is player scarcity in terms of overall MLB talent, but just as significant is scarcity based on who is available. Last year for example, most of the top catchers were available in the draft whereas only 1 of the top 15 closers was. This creates a position scarcity situation unique to each team... and one that will only be exaggerated by having two new teams (I think)...
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby Goatrider » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:47 pm

Well, one thing I do know is the more teams; the more difficult, more realistic, and more fun :)
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby ayebatter » Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:51 am

bigh0rt wrote:
lane_anasazi2 wrote:That's a very broad topic, but in general the difference between 10 and 12 teams isn't huge.

You're talking about going from a 400 player pool to a 480 player pool. The difference here is going to be much more severe than in your standard league.


Correcto h0rt, to combat this you'll need to allocate more dollars for you starters, and weaken your bench a bunch.
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Re: Expansion advice

Postby bigh0rt » Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:55 am

ayebatter wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:
lane_anasazi2 wrote:That's a very broad topic, but in general the difference between 10 and 12 teams isn't huge.

You're talking about going from a 400 player pool to a 480 player pool. The difference here is going to be much more severe than in your standard league.


Correcto h0rt, to combat this you'll need to allocate more dollars for you starters, and weaken your bench a bunch.
20% increase in players in a league already 400 players deep is crazy. The end of your bench is going to be the cheapest group of guys you hope don't suck of all-time.
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