Fantasy Baseball Cafe Forums

by **A man in a box** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:00 am

Below is the list don't know how to make this a poll. Should be on here. I will bold the ones I would vote for.

Barry Larkin
Jack Morris
Lee Smith
Jeff Bagwell
Tim Raines
Edgar Martinez
Alan Trammell
Larry Walker
Mark McGwire
Fred McGriff
Don Mattingly
Dale Murphy
Rafael Palmeiro
Juan González
Jeromy Burnitz
Vinny Castilla
Brian Jordan
Javy López
Bill Mueller
Terry Mulholland
Phil Nevin
Brad Radke
Tim Salmon
Rubén Sierra
Bernie Williams
Tony Womack
Eric Young

by **fast dogs** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:28 am

2012 BBWAA Hall of Fame Ballot
The "other" players:
Fred McGriff
Don Mattingly
Dale Murphy
Rafael Palmeiro
Juan González
Jeromy Burnitz
Vinny Castilla
Brian Jordan
Javy López
Bill Mueller
Terry Mulholland
Phil Nevin
Brad Radke
Tim Salmon
Rubén Sierra
Bernie Williams
Tony Womack
Eric Young

by **fast dogs** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:31 am

I tried to put your post in a poll form; wasn't sure what 9 made the poll and who should be left in the "other" but put them in the order you had them. I can delete that post or the OP this 1 if theres a better way of doing it or a different # of votes

by **thedude** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:20 am

Larkin, Edgar Martinez, Bagwell, and Tim Raines are all deserving IMO. McGwire and Palmeiro are hall of famers, but won't make it.

This ballot has a couple of my favorite players in Bernie Williams and Bill Mueller.

by **Surfs up** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:35 am

I agree with with post above me. I love Trammell but very good players lie him no not belong in the HOF.
The HOF is for the ELITE only. NOT the very good. I know I know. There are a few already in that don't belong. So do we continue to water it down? I think not. Stop the bleeding NOW !!

by **A man in a box** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:54 pm

thedude wrote:This ballot has a couple of my favorite players in Bernie Williams and Bill Mueller.

Larry Walker was one my favorite players growing up but injuries de-railed him. He truly had 1st ballot HOF talent. I kind of view him as a 90's Dale Murphy. Is there anyway Albert Belle can get back on the ballot I know he was a jerk but doesn't he pass the 10 year sniff test?

by **SpecialFNK** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:00 pm

the 2 names that jump out are McGuire and Palmeiro, but I can't see human voters voting for them.

I don't really remember much specifics of these players, so right now I mostly just have numbers to look at. I also right now have no idea how their career numbers match up vs other current HOF players or how they rank all time.

Barry Larkin? .295/.371/.444/.815/ 2340 hits/
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/3901/career
doesn't look like someone who was great, but he did play SS, from a time when SS was not a big offensive position. I wouldn't call him elite, but in this HOF I would say good enough.

Jeff Bagwell - .297/.408/.540/.948/ 449 HR/ 1529 RBI/ 2314 hits/
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/4626/career
he should be in.

Tim Raines? .294/.385/.425/.810/ 808 SB/ 2605 hits/ 1571 R/
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/1850/career
doesn't jump out as someone great, but he did have 808 SB with 1571 R while batting leadoff.

Edgar Martinez - .312/.418/.515/.933/ 2247 hits/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/4135/career
I don't think he should get valued down because he was a DH. he was still an elite hitter, and should be in the HOF.

Alan Trammell - .285/.352/.415/.767/ 2365 hits/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/1028/career
really good for a long period of time, but no.

Larry Walker. .313/.400/.565/.965/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/4181/career
some really impressive numbers, BUT he REALLY got to benefit from playing in Coors back when it was a great hitters park. should he be valued down because of that? 6 seasons with an OPS above 1.000, but all while with Colorado. or was he just fortunate and you still have to count his career numbers regardless of where he played?

Fred McGriff - .284/.377/.509/.886/ 493 HR/ 1550 RBI/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/3579/career
I feel biased towards McGriff because he used to be my favorite player. I feel like maybe he is borderline. not what I would call all time great, but in this HOF he should be good enough to get in.

Don Mattingly - .307/.358/.471/.830/ 2153 hits/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/3056/career
only 14 seasons. 1 MVP, 1 batting title. started with back troubles in 1990 and wasn't the same until he finished in 1995. career wise not what I would call elite.

Dale Murphy - .265/.346/.469/.815/ 2111 hits/.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/1587/career
he did have back to back MVP awards in 1982 and 1983, but his career numbers don't look elite.

Juan Gonzalez - .295/.343/.561/.904/ 434 HR/
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/4398/career
was he not someone who was connected to steroids/PED? if so can't see voters voting for him.

Bernie Williams - .297/.381/.477/.858/ 2336 hits/
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/4695/career
looks really good, but not great.

Jack Morris. - 254 W/ 3.90 ERA/ 1.30 WHIP.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/2263/career
doesn't look like someone great.

by **Tavish** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:01 pm

Larkin, Bagwell, Raines, McGwire. McGwire is on the edge for me and I wouldn't be too upset either way for him. The first three are no doubters for me.

by **Element** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:51 pm

Tavish wrote:Larkin, Bagwell, Raines, McGwire. McGwire is on the edge for me and I wouldn't be too upset either way for him. The first three are no doubters for me.

If you let McGwire in then you pretty much need to let Palmiero in (as well as Sosa once eligible). Mac is a very likeable player. I would love to see him in, but I think that it would be a mistake.

I agree with your first three. Larkin & Raines were uniquely great for their eras. Bagwell is just a slam dunk, IMO.

by **jfg** » Tue Dec 20, 2011 1:51 pm

Jeff Bagwell
Rafael Palmeiro
Edgar Martinez
Larry Walker
Mark McGwire
Don Mattingly
Rafael Palmeiro
Bernie Williams
Barry Larkin
Jack Morris

I think this is as good of a year as any to just bite the bullet and put all of the controversial candidates in the Hall. There isn't anybody this year who needs their own stage, so get the juicers, the DH and the Coors guy in there all at once and get the media circus out of the way in one year to put a rest to that chapter. Don Mattingly needs to get in this year. He's not even a borderline candidate like a Juan Gonzalez, he's a legitimate HOFer who was one of the biggest stars in the 80's. Larkin is borderline but I'd vote for him.