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Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby bleach168 » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:28 pm

Madison wrote:
urbanbreez wrote:Go ahead, cash that check. You are entitled to it.


Absolutely. I am certainly entitled to the money I paid in, am I not? Isn't that exactly what you are whining about? That you won't get YOUR money?

And since I figured you'd act like that, I've done some research for you.

Here's the tax table:

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/progdata/taxRates.html

So, we'll say a worker who worked 50 years with an average salary of $60K and we'll say 10% as the average tax rate (currently over 15%).

That's $300,000 they paid in.

That person would retire at 67 and have to draw $1,200 per month until they were 87 before the PRINCIPAL would run out. That doesn't even count the interest.

And for those who pay self-employment taxes (like myself since I've always had a business of some sort), we pay every nickel of that money. Half isn't paid by our employer (who's the "entitled" one now ;-7 ?).

So yeah, I think I am more than entitled to a portion of the money that the government took from me, because I will not live long enough to get it all back through social security, seeing as how the average lifespan is only 78:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

Game Over. B-)


Allow me to change just one variable: "Female version of Madison" :-b

Female version averages 45k per year since women make less money.
Female version lives 6 years longer since women just live longer.
In the year 2060, median female life expectancy is probably going to be approaching 90 years.

I'm not going to do the math, but my guess is social security is going to treat you fairly equitably.

Now, if you consider that the median woman makes a lot less than 45k a year, then that's where all your money goes, Mad. You are literally paying money into social security so the grandmothers of America don't have to live on the streets.
Last edited by bleach168 on Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby bleach168 » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:28 pm

double post
"And so he spoke, and so he spoke, that lord of Castamere. But now the rains weep o'er his hall, with no one there to hear." - The Rains of Castamere
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby urbanbreez » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:32 pm

Madison wrote:
urbanbreez wrote:Go ahead, cash that check. You are entitled to it.


Absolutely. I am certainly entitled to the money I paid in, am I not? Isn't that exactly what you are whining about? That you won't get YOUR money?

And since I figured you'd act like that, I've done some research for you.

Here's the tax table:

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/progdata/taxRates.html

So, we'll say a worker who worked 50 years with an average salary of $60K and we'll say 10% as the average tax rate (currently over 15%).

That's $300,000 they paid in.

That person would retire at 67 and have to draw $1,200 per month until they were 87 before the PRINCIPAL would run out. That doesn't even count the interest.

And for those who pay self-employment taxes (like myself since I've always had a business of some sort), we pay every nickel of that money. Half isn't paid by our employer (who's the "entitled" one now ;-7 ?).

So yeah, I think I am more than entitled to a portion of the money that the government took from me, because I will not live long enough to get it all back through social security, seeing as how the average lifespan is only 78:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

Game Over. B-)


You either a) don't understand tax law or b) think I don't, and decided to make up bs about how awesome you are for running a small business and paying higher taxes thereby entitling you a larger portion of a federal ponzi scheme. In either case, you should probably find an accountant to explain how taxes work for your small business in regards to SS.

For small business owners there are two income tax deductions that reduce your taxes.

First, your net earnings from self-­employ­ment are reduced by half of your total Social Security tax. This is similar to the way employees are treated under the tax laws, because the employer’s share of the Social Security tax is not ­considered wages to the employee.

Second, you can deduct half of your Social Security tax on IRS Form 1040. But the deduction must be taken from your gross income in determining your adjusted gross income. It cannot be an itemized deduction and must not be listed on your Schedule C.

If you have wages as well as self-­employ­ment earnings, the tax on your wages is paid first. But this rule is important only if your total earnings are more than $106,800. For example, if you will have $30,000 in wages and $40,000 in self-employment income in 2011, you will pay the appropriate Social Security taxes on both your wages and business earnings. However, in 2011, if your wages are $77,500 and you have $30,000 in net earnings from a business, you do not pay dual Social Security taxes on earnings more than $106,800. Your employer will withhold 5.65 percent in Social Security and Medicare taxes on your $77,500 in earnings. You must pay 13.3 percent in Social Security and Medicare taxes on your first $29,300 in self-employment earnings and 2.9 percent in Medicare tax on the remaining $700 in earnings.



Your expectation of return in a federal Ponzi scheme makes the verbiage in your sig even more hilarious and your hypocrisy even more poignant (which is what I'm actually complaining about). You don't get to have it both ways, cowboy.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby Madison » Wed Aug 10, 2011 5:51 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:Mad, I'll tell you right here that I'm willing to die for my country. Why can't that be enough? Why do I have to kill for my country?


Did I ask anyone if they would kill for this country? :-?

There's a difference in accepting a necessary measure and being the one to carry it out. A death penalty that has teeth is a necessary measure and I expect people to understand that (they can absolutely hate it for all I care, but understanding that it is necessary shouldn't be such a problem). Of course, I don't expect them to be the ones to pull the trigger. The two are very different things.

In a much tamer version, ever have your kid cry when you punished them (any punishment - losing television or video games, or being grounded, etc,)? I've been there (unfortunately, many times). It doesn't make me feel good and it hurts to do it, but it is necessary in order for the child to learn and understand right and wrong, and I will continue to punish my son when he deserves it because I know it is in his best interest to learn and understand how to behave. I don't expect any parent to be happy about punishing their kid, but I do expect them to understand that it is a necessary measure.

bleach168 wrote:Allow me to change just one variable: "Female version of Madison" :-b

Female version averages 45k per year since women make less money.
Female version lives 6 years longer since women just live longer.
In the year 2060, median female life expectancy is probably going to be approaching 90 years.

I'm not going to do the math, but my guess is social security is going to treat you fairly equitably.

Now, if you consider that the median woman makes a lot less than 45k a year, then that's where all your money goes, Mad. You are literally paying money into social security so the grandmothers of America don't have to live on the streets.


That is mostly true (I'll save the discussion unless you want to discuss - your call :-) ). But since urbanbreez was all "I, I, I, ME, ME, ME" I went with a fitting example. ;-)

urbanbreez wrote:You either a) don't understand tax law or b) think I don't, and decided to make up bs about how awesome you are for running a small business and paying higher taxes thereby entitling you a larger portion of a federal ponzi scheme. In either case, you should probably find an accountant to explain how taxes work for your small business in regards to SS.


A - the math is right there, show me where it is wrong.

B - I only mentioned I pay in 100% of my social security taxes where as you only pay in 50% of yours since you wanted to cry about not getting "your" money (yet it is wrong for me to get "some" of the money I paid in - and half of what you pay in isn't even paid by you - wow, too funny :-b )

urbanbreez wrote:Your expectation of return in a federal Ponzi scheme makes the verbiage in your sig even more hilarious and your hypocrisy even more poignant (which is what I'm actually complaining about). You don't get to have it both ways, cowboy.


Simple fact of the matter is I will get A PORTION of what I have paid into social security, NOT THE FULL AMOUNT. So exactly how am I a hypocrite when I'm funding other people's social security? :-?

If you want to lash out, go after food stamps, welfare, etc. Go after people that pay nothing, but get things in return. Pretty stupid to go after someone who *might* get 50% of their principal back, and never seeing a nickel of the interest.
Yes doctor, I am sick.
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Sick of those who are hypocrites.
Yes doctor, an army is forming.
Yes doctor, there will be a war.
Yes doctor, there will be blood.....
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby Dan Lambskin » Wed Aug 10, 2011 7:19 pm

so who had page 13 in the Goodwins Law pool
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby knapplc » Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:35 pm

It's Godwin's Law, and it's stupid. Considering the fact that the average person is not well-read, or has much beyond an eighth-grade education, inevitably conversations fall to using common denominators to make points. Since Hitler/Nazis are basically a byword for "wrong" or "evil" or whatever bad thing you want to represent, it's logical to presume it'll be used in conversation eventually.

Citing Godwin's Law doesn't obviate the point being made. It just muddies the water.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby Neato Torpedo » Thu Aug 11, 2011 1:35 am

knapplc wrote:It's Godwin's Law, and it's stupid. Considering the fact that the average person is not well-read, or has much beyond an eighth-grade education, inevitably conversations fall to using common denominators to make points. Since Hitler/Nazis are basically a byword for "wrong" or "evil" or whatever bad thing you want to represent, it's logical to presume it'll be used in conversation eventually.

Citing Godwin's Law doesn't obviate the point being made. It just muddies the water.

No, it's Goodwin's Law, named after Tom Goodwin, cited every time someone overvalues a crappy player's real life value based only on his stolen base totals.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby wrveres » Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:21 am

urbanbreez wrote:
Not to bust your little bubble, but when I start drawing social security, it will be the money I paid in (not you), that I will be getting back. Retirement age is what, 67 now? So if I retire at 67, I'll have paid in for 51 years and will be getting back MY money (again, not yours).


Not to burst your little bubble but the money you paid in was used for the generation before you. When it gets to be my turn, there will be nothing. If you truly think that way you should refuse to cash that government check.
I tell ya what. Give me back what i put in, plus say a simple two percent interest, and I'll walk away. The government wil probably come out ahead overall, and im okay with that. Just give me mine back now, the money they took without my consent, and i'll walk away.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby wrveres » Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:23 am

urbanbreez wrote:Go ahead, cash that check. You are entitled to it.
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class warfare for the win.
You make for a good obamahead.
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Re: Norway's One Man Wrecking Crew

Postby wrveres » Thu Aug 11, 2011 3:40 am

urbanbreez wrote:I never said "yeah government" and never will, tyvm. Straw man argument, Dude.
You dont preach the socialism? My apologies. I was under the impression you were a proud socialist. Now your not so proud, or did i just misread you, dude?
urbanbreez wrote:By "Comedy Channel," I assume you're referring to The Daily Show with John Stewart and The Colbert report? Because they make jokes to illustrate a point and don't scream like lunatics nothing they say means anything? Illogical, dude.
They also purposely leave out important facts, or edit peoples words out of context, to make a Joke. But that doesn't matter now does it? Its all about the point, dude. No matter how incorrect that point is ... and they can get away with it saying its comedy, dude.
Enjoy your government Social Security Check that I'll be flipping the bill for over the next 20 years of my working life only to never see a dime of it. Take a vacation... on me, buddy.
yeah with that two grand a month, im going to feed the cats caviar every night, buddy
Just stop crying about big government while you run to the bank with a portion of my income. ;-)
You fail to acknowledge that i wasn't given a choice. You Yeah Government types didn't give me an opt out. And speaking of an opt out, every time someone tries to fix the issue, you Yeah Government types start in with the demagoguery.

"THEY HATE OLD PEOPLE!"


This country has a spending problem, not an income problem, and I can almost guarantee you the last two times at the ballot box, you pulled the lever to spend .. Again. You deserve what you vote for. Im thinking about hiding some income and getting those foodstamps. I hear that government bread is tasty. As a plus, unlimited slurpees, and 7-11 hot dogs, on your dime. :-)

thanks, and keep voting democrat.. .. buddy. its a win win!
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