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5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby bigh0rt » Wed May 04, 2011 2:17 pm

Stephen Colbert: Bin laden still terrorizing america by helping the re-election of Barack Obama
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby StlSluggers » Wed May 04, 2011 2:19 pm

bigh0rt wrote:Stephen Colbert: Bin laden still terrorizing america by helping the re-election of Barack Obama

I'm glad someone had the balls to say it. :-°
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby thejusman1 » Wed May 04, 2011 2:59 pm

bigh0rt wrote:Stephen Colbert: Bin laden still terrorizing america by helping the re-election of Barack Obama


AMEN!
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby Madison » Wed May 04, 2011 3:18 pm

Phatferd wrote:
Madison wrote:Glad to see Bin Laden is finally dead. ;-D Took far too long and cost far too many lives, but at least that is finished now.

Phatferd wrote:
Agree with this premise, however, Bush had 8 years and did nothing, but begin the meltdown of our country. Obama, came in and tried really hard to come off as bi-partisan and bent over at every possible situation to the republicans. Over the past few months his tone has changed and he has 2 years to redeem himself.

So the point I'm trying to make is Bush never learned his lesson, Obama still has time to change things around.


Wat? 8-o

His mandated health care is a perfect example of where the underlined isn't accurate.


First, the "mandated health care" is not even close to what most people wanted with a public option, he moved so far to the center (from the left) to make republicans happy.

Second, how do you explain him caving to the tax cuts in order to get the Republicans to OK extending unemployment in the middle of a recession?


I was stunned and said it wrong, it's "mandated health insurance", big difference, my mistake. Anyway, if the Republicans are happy, why are they going to do everything in their power to repeal it? It's a terrible piece of work that does zero to reduce the cost of health care (while skyrocketing the cost of health insurance), and everyone knows it. So no, the Republicans are not happy. I subscribe to neither political party, but the Republicans have this particular topic correct. Obamacare needs to vanish and the government needs to go back to the drawing board to figure out how to actually bring down the cost of health care (that means going after the doctors and hospitals for their overcharging, which in turn would make health insurance affordable).

He couldn't slam people with huge insurance bills and then eliminate the tax cuts. Obama's an idiot, but he's not completely insane. He played the game exactly the way he wanted it to go.

StlSluggers wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:Stephen Colbert: Bin laden still terrorizing america by helping the re-election of Barack Obama

I'm glad someone had the balls to say it. :-°


I'd have said it first had I thought of it first. :-b
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby Neato Torpedo » Wed May 04, 2011 3:45 pm

Madison wrote:figure out how to actually bring down the cost of health care (that means going after the doctors and hospitals for their overcharging, which in turn would make health insurance affordable).

How would you address the scarcity of doctors then? If doctors don't get as much money then fewer people would be willing to go through the extremely difficult (not to mention expensive) process of becoming one. As a result, there would be longer waiting periods for urgent medical care which is one of the central arguments against a public option.
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby Madison » Wed May 04, 2011 4:12 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:
Madison wrote:figure out how to actually bring down the cost of health care (that means going after the doctors and hospitals for their overcharging, which in turn would make health insurance affordable).

How would you address the scarcity of doctors then? If doctors don't get as much money then fewer people would be willing to go through the extremely difficult (not to mention expensive) process of becoming one. As a result, there would be longer waiting periods for urgent medical care which is one of the central arguments against a public option.


What scarcity of doctors? Everything I've seen suggests the argument is simply to pull the wool over the eyes of the public, meaning most people don't really do the research to realize the argument isn't true.

Regardless, as to ensuring there are plenty of doctors in the future, give more grants, scholarships, a new program, whatever, there are tons of options. Then they don't graduate with crazy debts and need to make crazy money to pay those crazy debts. This isn't rocket science.
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby bigh0rt » Wed May 04, 2011 4:16 pm

Madison wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:
Madison wrote:figure out how to actually bring down the cost of health care (that means going after the doctors and hospitals for their overcharging, which in turn would make health insurance affordable).

How would you address the scarcity of doctors then? If doctors don't get as much money then fewer people would be willing to go through the extremely difficult (not to mention expensive) process of becoming one. As a result, there would be longer waiting periods for urgent medical care which is one of the central arguments against a public option.


What scarcity of doctors? Everything I've seen suggests the argument is simply to pull the wool over the eyes of the public, meaning most people don't really do the research to realize the argument isn't true.

Regardless, as to ensuring there are plenty of doctors in the future, give more grants, scholarships, a new program, whatever, there are tons of options. Then they don't graduate with crazy debts and need to make crazy money to pay those crazy debts. This isn't rocket science.

We've gone this route in other threads. We can likely agree that we want the absolute best and brightest when it comes to our health. Also, that it takes more schooling, training, and cost to become a doctor than almost anything else in the united states. You take away doctors being one of the highest paying professions in this country and neither of the aforementioned will be the case, which is absolutely not a good thing. Costs are too high for a bevy of reasons, the vast majority of which are not because doctors themselves are overpaid. My future brother in law is in medical school at Penn and I can assure you that whatever he ends up making he'll have rightly and fully earned through the time, effort, sacrifice, and fiscal burden he's gone through to become one.
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby Curtis Pride » Wed May 04, 2011 4:32 pm

For the record, I don't want the best and brightest for our health. History has shown us that technological innovations have far more impact in overall health than quality of doctors. You may have the best doctors in the world working in third world countries, but the fact that their government and economic infrastructure do not support industry effectively resulting sparse access to fresh water and electricity, they are going to have high infant mortality rates and shorter life spans.

The lightbulb, internal combustion engine, and the computer had a far greater impact on the health and lifespans of humans than all doctors who have or will ever walk the face of the earth ever could.

Regarding a "shortage of doctors". Mandating 4 years of post graduate medical school followed by 3 years of residency so that someone can finally become a doctor with $300k-$400k worth of debt only to have 1/3 of their income lost to malpractice insurance (and half of what's left to taxes), is a major contributor to the limit on doctors.

But it's not just the government that's creating that or can fix it.
* The AMA wants to make it difficult to become a doctor so that their members have less competition.
* The legal profession goes after doctors because there is absolutely no consequence to filing faulty wasteful law suits
* idiot Americans who serve on juries and constantly give neglectful morons large judgements against doctors
* The structure of our healthcare industry makes it so the person getting treatment has no idea what it costs nor are they liable for paying for any of it, so doctors have to deal with massive amounts of paperwork
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby jfg » Wed May 04, 2011 5:04 pm

Difficult choice on whether to show the pictures or not. I agree with the decision because it comes off to me like those beheading videos. That's what terrorists do, and I think it's below the most poweful country in the world to do so. However, polls show that there isn't much trust when it comes to the government right now.
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Re: 5/1, President's Surprise Speech: Bin Laden is Dead

Postby Curtis Pride » Wed May 04, 2011 5:08 pm

I find it hilarious that the general public feels fine shooting him in the face in spite of him being unarmed, yet "ohhhh, showing pictures to prove he's dead? That's poor form."

Obviously, I have no qualms about him being dead and our murdering him given the volume of evidence against him, but fact is: we killed him instead of capturing him despite the fact that he was unarmed
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