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12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vetoed?

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12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vetoed?

Postby tommo » Mon Apr 18, 2011 2:39 pm

I recently tried to trade Colby Rasmus for Carl Crawford. Crawford's owner accepted the deal however the league commissioner Vetoed the trade so it didn't go through. Do you think it should have been allowed?
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby Hes So Taguchi » Mon Apr 18, 2011 2:59 pm

Most people here are going to tell you that trades should never be vetoed unless there is proof of collusion.

I do not subscribe to that school of thought. I am the commissioner of my league and we use a commissioner veto system. This makes it so trades can be executed quickly and it also ensures that trades will not be vetoed because of petty BS.

This is our 5th year and I have never vetoed a trade. Most of that is due to the fact that I play with people who understand baseball and don't try to fleece eachother w garbage trades.

I would have to give some serious thought as to whether I let this go through. I think it's clear that Rasmus is a good player with lots of upside. I think a quick look at his peripherals will demonstrate, however, that his current play is unsustainable. If it were another month into the season I may think otherwise, but the season isn't even 3 weeks old.

You're definitely taking advantage of the other owner's ignorance. The question at this point is whether or not the inequity is so egregious as to affect the balance of the league. If you held me at gunpoint I'd have to say no and let this trade through.

Having said that, I completely understand where your comissioner is coming from.
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby TrippySG » Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:18 pm

I partially agree with the above poster, but only to a certain degree. What if the other manager really believed Rasmus was going to play lights out this year? What if he really wanted Rasmus and this was the only way to get him? What if Crawford gets hurt next week for the rest of the season? My point is that baseball stats are never purely predictable, and it is totally within the realm of possibilities that Rasmus outplays Crawford this yr based on his upside and past performace. In under 450 AB last yr, his second yr, he hit over 20 HR, maintained a solid avg and posted 85 R with 12 SB. Crawford hit 19 in 600 AB, albeit his R and SB were higher. Crawford is at the height of his offensive capabilities, Rasmus is starting his 3rd yr with high improvement possibilities. ARod had 23 hr his second yr, then the next yr went yard 42 times... The possibilities are there and therefore I think in no way should it be vetoed.

If this is a keeper league it makes even less sense to turn it down, especially if Crawford is not eligible for keeper status.
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby tommo » Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:29 pm

TrippySG wrote:I partially agree with the above poster, but only to a certain degree. What if the other manager really believed Rasmus was going to play lights out this year? What if he really wanted Rasmus and this was the only way to get him? What if Crawford gets hurt next week for the rest of the season? My point is that baseball stats are never purely predictable, and it is totally within the realm of possibilities that Rasmus outplays Crawford this yr based on his upside and past performace. In under 450 AB last yr, his second yr, he hit over 20 HR, maintained a solid avg and posted 85 R with 12 SB. Crawford hit 19 in 600 AB, albeit his R and SB were higher. Crawford is at the height of his offensive capabilities, Rasmus is starting his 3rd yr with high improvement possibilities. ARod had 23 hr his second yr, then the next yr went yard 42 times... The possibilities are there and therefore I think in no way should it be vetoed.

If this is a keeper league it makes even less sense to turn it down, especially if Crawford is not eligible for keeper status.


Thank you both for your responses. It actually is a keeper league which is another argument I brought up considering Rasmus is eligible and Crawford is not. It's unfortunate that the trade has already be denied. I still want to go after Crawford, but it doesn't seem like I will be able to get him for a discount, so it might not be worth it.
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby Hes So Taguchi » Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:32 pm

TrippySG wrote:I partially agree with the above poster, but only to a certain degree. What if the other manager really believed Rasmus was going to play lights out this year? What if he really wanted Rasmus and this was the only way to get him? What if Crawford gets hurt next week for the rest of the season? My point is that baseball stats are never purely predictable, and it is totally within the realm of possibilities that Rasmus outplays Crawford this yr based on his upside and past performace. In under 450 AB last yr, his second yr, he hit over 20 HR, maintained a solid avg and posted 85 R with 12 SB. Crawford hit 19 in 600 AB, albeit his R and SB were higher. Crawford is at the height of his offensive capabilities, Rasmus is starting his 3rd yr with high improvement possibilities. ARod had 23 hr his second yr, then the next yr went yard 42 times... The possibilities are there and therefore I think in no way should it be vetoed.

If this is a keeper league it makes even less sense to turn it down, especially if Crawford is not eligible for keeper status.


I agree with a lot of what you said, which is why I would let it go through, albeit grudingly. If it were a keeper league I would have no problem allowing it.
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby TrippySG » Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:37 pm

tommo wrote:
TrippySG wrote:I partially agree with the above poster, but only to a certain degree. What if the other manager really believed Rasmus was going to play lights out this year? What if he really wanted Rasmus and this was the only way to get him? What if Crawford gets hurt next week for the rest of the season? My point is that baseball stats are never purely predictable, and it is totally within the realm of possibilities that Rasmus outplays Crawford this yr based on his upside and past performace. In under 450 AB last yr, his second yr, he hit over 20 HR, maintained a solid avg and posted 85 R with 12 SB. Crawford hit 19 in 600 AB, albeit his R and SB were higher. Crawford is at the height of his offensive capabilities, Rasmus is starting his 3rd yr with high improvement possibilities. ARod had 23 hr his second yr, then the next yr went yard 42 times... The possibilities are there and therefore I think in no way should it be vetoed.

If this is a keeper league it makes even less sense to turn it down, especially if Crawford is not eligible for keeper status.


Thank you both for your responses. It actually is a keeper league which is another argument I brought up considering Rasmus is eligible and Crawford is not. It's unfortunate that the trade has already be denied. I still want to go after Crawford, but it doesn't seem like I will be able to get him for a discount, so it might not be worth it.


Yeah considering it is a keeper league AND Crawford isnt an eligible keeper I dont see the rational behind a commish-veto. If the league vetoed it by vote, youre out of luck and theyre not looking at the long term ramifications of the trade, maybe time to start looking into alternate leagues with more knowledgable and/or aggresive owners. If its the commish, an appeal may be heard, and I think its worth trying if you need to win this year and Crawford gives you that chance. If not, just be happy you get to keep Rasmus next yr
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Re: 12tm H2H Points League Should Rasmus for Crawford be Vet

Postby skones » Mon Apr 18, 2011 5:10 pm

Rasmus posted an .859 OPS last season in comparison to .851 OPS. With that being said, Crawford will always have the advantage as far as speed is concerned, but at the same time, Rasmus has far more pop in his bat and he is now hitting in a much more favorable spot in the lineup than he was last season after clashing with LaRussa which should bump his run totals considerably. I'm of the opinion that Rasmus is in line for an absolutely MONSTER season. With that being the case, I'd have no problem with this deal going through. Rasmus is only two years removed from being the number 3 prospect in all of baseball. He isn't a flash in the pan. I don't think 105 runs, 27 HR, 72 RBI, and 15 SB are that out of the question for Rasmus.

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