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Jeter or Renteria

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Postby mtarail » Sun Mar 28, 2004 4:17 pm

Amazinz wrote:Over eight years (not counting the 15 games in '95) Jeter has only missed .300 twice.

1997 - .291
2002 - .297

I bet he's around .310 this year give or take.

Renteria has only batted .300+ three times. His rookie year and '02-'03. .330 is an abbherration. His SO totals have consistently dropped and he is a far more patient hitter now but he doesn't hit .330 again this year IMHO.


If he hit 320 he'd still be hitting at a higher average than any other SS. He's 28 and he's improved every year.

As I said earlier, between Jeter's 2003 injury from sliding into a base and the bats around him this year I doubt that Jeter gets many bags this year.
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Postby crazycanuck » Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:12 pm

I can't believe this is even being debated...It's amazing how over-rated Jeter is because he's a Yankee...Renteria is outmatched by only one SS, and he'll be playing 3rd base this year.
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Postby ajgnydc722 » Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:14 pm

crazycanuck wrote:I can't believe this is even being debated...It's amazing how over-rated Jeter is because he's a Yankee...Renteria is outmatched by only one SS, and he'll be playing 3rd base this year.


renteria outmatches garciaparra and tejada? :-?
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imo

Postby jpbusta » Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:17 pm

renteria no doubt.
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Postby Amazinz » Sun Mar 28, 2004 7:54 pm

Renteria out-matches Jeter? I'm no Yankeed-lover being a Mets fan and all but lets not go overboard. Jeter is a year older then Renteria they both had their first full MLB season in '96. They both have 8 full seasons played. When you compare their offensive numbers over the last 8 seasons Renteria out-matches Jeter? No.

8 year totals:

-------------AVG HR RBI R SB
Renteria--.289 73 493 650 220
Jeter-------.317 127 608 921 178
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Postby TheRawDAWG » Sun Mar 28, 2004 8:26 pm

crazycanuck wrote:I can't believe this is even being debated...It's amazing how over-rated Jeter is because he's a Yankee...Renteria is outmatched by only one SS, and he'll be playing 3rd base this year.


Uh I love the Leafs line. But with that comment about outplaying every other SS leads me to believe you need to stick with hockey.

SS Rankings:

1. A-Rod
2. Nomar
3. Tejada
4. Rents/ Jeter


And for the sake of the thread I'll say I'd take Jeter because in the drafts I've participated in Rents is going 2nd early 3rd. Jeter is going 4th or 5th. And he'll probably score 300 runs this year.
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Postby mtarail » Sun Mar 28, 2004 8:44 pm

Amazinz wrote:Renteria out-matches Jeter? I'm no Yankeed-lover being a Mets fan and all but lets not go overboard. Jeter is a year older then Renteria they both had their first full MLB season in '96. They both have 8 full seasons played. When you compare their offensive numbers over the last 8 seasons Renteria out-matches Jeter? No.

8 year totals:

-------------AVG HR RBI R SB
Renteria--.289 73 493 650 220
Jeter-------.317 127 608 921 178



What the hell do 8 year totals prove? As Janet (Ms. Jackson if you're nasty) Jackson said: "What have you done for me lately?"

If you consider 8 year totals then I guess Palmeiro, Vinny Castilla, and Bernie Williams are studs and Bret Boone, Renteria, and Gagne aren't.

I'm not a Yankees fan or a Cardinals fan, but Renteria's #'s don't look like a fluke to me. He beat Jeter in average last year (by a lot), and I think he will this year too. But what distinguished him from every other SS are his SB's.
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Postby TheRawDAWG » Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:06 pm

mtarail wrote:
Amazinz wrote:Renteria out-matches Jeter? I'm no Yankeed-lover being a Mets fan and all but lets not go overboard. Jeter is a year older then Renteria they both had their first full MLB season in '96. They both have 8 full seasons played. When you compare their offensive numbers over the last 8 seasons Renteria out-matches Jeter? No.

8 year totals:

-------------AVG HR RBI R SB
Renteria--.289 73 493 650 220
Jeter-------.317 127 608 921 178



What the hell do 8 year totals prove? As Janet (Ms. Jackson if you're nasty) Jackson said: "What have you done for me lately?"

If you consider 8 year totals then I guess Palmeiro, Vinny Castilla, and Bernie Williams are studs and Bret Boone, Renteria, and Gagne aren't.

I'm not a Yankees fan or a Cardinals fan, but Renteria's #'s don't look like a fluke to me. He beat Jeter in average last year (by a lot), and I think he will this year too. But what distinguished him from every other SS are his SB's.


Ok then, lets throw out previous years numbers for a sec. You say Rents beat Jeter in average 'by a lot'? What do you consider 'a lot'? Jeter hit .324 last year and Rents hit .330. So .006 is a lot? I don't really think so.

Here are the stats from last year so we can really have a nice discussion about them without people talking out their ass and hoping no one will notice:

Jeter: ABs: 482 Runs: 87 HRs: 10 RBIs:52 SBs: 11 Avg: .324

Rents: ABs: 587 Runs: 96 HRs: 13 RBIs: 100 SBs: 34 Avg: .330

So lets see, Rents had 105 more Abs and only put up 3 more homers. So playing over a full season I'm sure Jeter would have beat him in that department.

Rents scored 9 more runs and I don't think anyone here would argue Jeter is going to score a ton more runs in the Yankee lineup.

Rents had a ton of RBIs which is pretty impressive. But like someone already mentioned he will be hitting 2nd in the order this year and wont be getting all those RBI opps. Of course this will increase his runs.

Rents did get a lot more SBs and being in the 2 hole he'll probably run more frequently. But I alos think Jeter will run a alot more than he did last year and be around 25 steals this year. Rents will probably be around 35-40.


Now Rents beat Jeter in Avg. last year but he hit waaaayyy above his career average which should send up some signals as to why he probably wont repeat. And since Jeter always hits around the .320 marks I think Jeter repeating that average has a better chance of happening.

So let me see what I've come up with.

Jeter will score more runs, hit more homers, have a higher average and could also drive in more runs.

Renteria will steal more bases and maybe drive in more runs.

Renteria second round choice or Jeter 5th round choice? I'd take Jeter.
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Postby Guest » Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:11 pm

The main advantage of having Rent over Jet, is if you are counting on getting the bulk of your steals from the SS position. If not a healthy Jet is a better option.
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Postby ajgnydc722 » Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:28 pm

TheRawDAWG wrote:
mtarail wrote:
Amazinz wrote:Renteria out-matches Jeter? I'm no Yankeed-lover being a Mets fan and all but lets not go overboard. Jeter is a year older then Renteria they both had their first full MLB season in '96. They both have 8 full seasons played. When you compare their offensive numbers over the last 8 seasons Renteria out-matches Jeter? No.

8 year totals:

-------------AVG HR RBI R SB
Renteria--.289 73 493 650 220
Jeter-------.317 127 608 921 178



What the hell do 8 year totals prove? As Janet (Ms. Jackson if you're nasty) Jackson said: "What have you done for me lately?"

If you consider 8 year totals then I guess Palmeiro, Vinny Castilla, and Bernie Williams are studs and Bret Boone, Renteria, and Gagne aren't.

I'm not a Yankees fan or a Cardinals fan, but Renteria's #'s don't look like a fluke to me. He beat Jeter in average last year (by a lot), and I think he will this year too. But what distinguished him from every other SS are his SB's.


Ok then, lets throw out previous years numbers for a sec. You say Rents beat Jeter in average 'by a lot'? What do you consider 'a lot'? Jeter hit .324 last year and Rents hit .330. So .006 is a lot? I don't really think so.

Here are the stats from last year so we can really have a nice discussion about them without people talking out their ass and hoping no one will notice:

Jeter: ABs: 482 Runs: 87 HRs: 10 RBIs:52 SBs: 11 Avg: .324

Rents: ABs: 587 Runs: 96 HRs: 13 RBIs: 100 SBs: 34 Avg: .330

So lets see, Rents had 105 more Abs and only put up 3 more homers. So playing over a full season I'm sure Jeter would have beat him in that department.

Rents scored 9 more runs and I don't think anyone here would argue Jeter is going to score a ton more runs in the Yankee lineup.

Rents had a ton of RBIs which is pretty impressive. But like someone already mentioned he will be hitting 2nd in the order this year and wont be getting all those RBI opps. Of course this will increase his runs.

Rents did get a lot more SBs and being in the 2 hole he'll probably run more frequently. But I alos think Jeter will run a alot more than he did last year and be around 25 steals this year. Rents will probably be around 35-40.


Now Rents beat Jeter in Avg. last year but he hit waaaayyy above his career average which should send up some signals as to why he probably wont repeat. And since Jeter always hits around the .320 marks I think Jeter repeating that average has a better chance of happening.

So let me see what I've come up with.

Jeter will score more runs, hit more homers, have a higher average and could also drive in more runs.

Renteria will steal more bases and maybe drive in more runs.

Renteria second round choice or Jeter 5th round choice? I'd take Jeter.


Couldn't have said it better myself. I almost fell off my chair when I read that Renteria killed Jeter in avgerage last year and will again.
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