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Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby wrveres » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:14 pm

its a vow between two people, and it doesn't even really need a church, imo. Its actually all become a financial scheme anyways. Marriage licences, alimony, palimony, tax breaks ... all that crap. Just get the government out of it.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby GiantsFan14 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:22 pm

A Fleshner Fantasy wrote:
GiantsFan14 wrote:This is seriously the easiest fix of any controversial issue. The government no longer uses the term marriage for anyone. Civil unions are used by the government for any two people who want to get "married". Marriages are given out at the discretion of churches. The whole argument that gays shouldn't be allowed to get married stems from the religious aspect of marriage, so separate religion and state and the whole thing is fixed.

Next problem please.


The discretion of the churches? So people who aren't Christian can't get married? Great solution. Rather than ending discrimination against gay people, let's discriminate against them AND a lot of others as well.


How is there any discrimination if everyone has the same rights in the eyes of the goverment. The actual term used doesn't change anything and if you aren't christian then why do you care about what term is being used?
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:31 pm

Agreed that everyone should have the same "marriage" rights, and the government shouldn't refer to it as such. If you want to get "married" in front of God, do it in a church. And if the church doesn't want to marry you, that's their right.

But the institutional discrimination against gays in this country has got to go.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby GiantsFan14 » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:54 pm

Curtis Pride wrote:Agreed that everyone should have the same "marriage" rights, and the government shouldn't refer to it as such. If you want to get "married" in front of God, do it in a church. And if the church doesn't want to marry you, that's their right.

But the institutional discrimination against gays in this country has got to go.


Exactly.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby The Artful Dodger » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:09 pm

GiantsFan14 wrote:
A Fleshner Fantasy wrote:
GiantsFan14 wrote:This is seriously the easiest fix of any controversial issue. The government no longer uses the term marriage for anyone. Civil unions are used by the government for any two people who want to get "married". Marriages are given out at the discretion of churches. The whole argument that gays shouldn't be allowed to get married stems from the religious aspect of marriage, so separate religion and state and the whole thing is fixed.

Next problem please.


The discretion of the churches? So people who aren't Christian can't get married? Great solution. Rather than ending discrimination against gay people, let's discriminate against them AND a lot of others as well.


How is there any discrimination if everyone has the same rights in the eyes of the goverment. The actual term used doesn't change anything and if you aren't christian then why do you care about what term is being used?


By the same token, why should it matter that any state unions be renamed from marriages to civil unions? If same-sex couples had the same rights as those as straight ones, they are the same union (marriage) and have the same rights under the eyes of the law... regardless if the ceremony was administered by a state or church, synagogue, mosque, etc.

I also agree that the church (or any other religious institution) reserves the right to not marry a couple.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby Madison » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:44 pm

bigh0rt wrote:
Madison wrote: So why can't the other states do the same thing and put this issue to bed once and for all? :-?

Same contrary question as six months ago. I'll even phrase it just like yours: "Why can't other states just allow same sex marriage and put this issue to bed once and for all?"

The solution is always so easy when we only consider our own side of it and viewpoints.


The majority of the country disagrees with same-sex "marriage" (so pushing that through would be a huge problem), but the majority does agree in allowing same-sex unions that are treated the same as marriages (which very few disagree with, so no problem). That's where the difference in your question and mine is. I'm not viewing it from a personal angle, I'm viewing it from the country's angle. One flies without any real problem, the other creates massive problems. Both options get what is being sought after (equal treatment), so why not do what can easily be done? :-?
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby Curtis Pride » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:54 pm

States can make their own laws about what is supported, and many have.

But that still wouldn't change the fact that federally marriage isn't allowed and their are numerous tax and legal implications because federal laws trump state laws.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby jfg » Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:56 pm

I highly doubt that civil unions would go through no problem. And even if it was passed it would still be a hot button issue. It's not a problem with allowing gays to be married, it's a problem with allowing gays to be gay.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby Madison » Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:50 pm

Curtis Pride wrote:States can make their own laws about what is supported, and many have.

But that still wouldn't change the fact that federally marriage isn't allowed and their are numerous tax and legal implications because federal laws trump state laws.


If all 50 states adopted a policy that makes civil unions equal to marriage, wouldn't the federal government have to acknowledge it and make changes? :-? Probably wouldn't even take all 50 doing it, 15-20 would probably suffice.

jfg wrote:I highly doubt that civil unions would go through no problem. And even if it was passed it would still be a hot button issue. It's not a problem with allowing gays to be married, it's a problem with allowing gays to be gay.


True, some would still gripe and whine and all that jazz, that goes for anything. There are still racists, sexists, etc, out there of course, and there will always be people against the gay and lesbian community as well. However, the majority is still in favor of allowing civil unions and giving those unions the same benefits of marriage. So it would be quite a bit easier to pass those laws.
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Re: Prop 8 Ruled Unconstitutional

Postby urbanbreez » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:11 pm

i think gay people are cool dudes, aside from all the sodomy. they are creative, cleanly, and non-threatening to my girlfriend or masculinity. then i moved in to my new place (friggin mansion, btw, huge ass tv. omg, u jelly?) and my neighbors are gay. i was like, cool... gay people near me. there will be elaborate holiday parties, neatly trimmed yards, and someplace my girl can hang out while i watch the game. but nope.com. they are snooty, pretentious, and obnoxious. they have a tiny dog. he barks for the sake of barking. i will kill and bury his ass in the trash the first chance i get. they wear "man bags" purses, really. yeah, i know. lol.

all that said, who gives an eff? why do you want to stick your nose in someone's business (nohomo)? let them get married if they want to. they should have the right to be miserably bonded with some jackass just like you and i.
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