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Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

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Who is worth more Wins?

Franklin Gutierrez
24
44%
Miguel Cabrera
30
56%
 
Total votes : 54

Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby Tavish » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:44 pm

baseball77 wrote:
Tavish wrote:
DaSh 1s wrote:I am trying to determine if WAR is a valuable stat when judging baseball players. Judging by WAR Franklin Gutierrez is a more valuable player than Miggy.

Quick poll, fantasy baseball aside, who is a better in ML Baseball? F-Gut or the utterly savage M-Cab???

Did you look up the WAR for the players this season?



Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.

Did you look up WAR for the players this season?
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby BitterDodgerFan » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:59 pm

StlSluggers wrote:What's an F-Gut? Sounds gross. :-P

its FraGu not F-Gut
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby HOOTIE » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:00 pm

DaSh 1s wrote:Please do not curse in the cafe.


Had to laugh. Carlin saying not to curse. :-b
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby HOOTIE » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:03 pm

baseball77 wrote:Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.


Triple Crown numbers? Unless you are a horse, the triple crown doesn't do much for me.
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby Neato Torpedo » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:26 pm

DaSh 1s wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:
JMB05 wrote:Do you ever just help the forum rather than being a dick to everyone who disagrees with you?

This is helping the Cafe. Proving WAR is not a tell all stat. Please do not curse in the cafe.

*uses an opinion poll to prove facts*
*fails Stats 101*

And you're still losing. :^
Last edited by Neato Torpedo on Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby baseball77 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:27 pm

HOOTIE wrote:
baseball77 wrote:Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.


Triple Crown numbers? Unless you are a horse, the triple crown doesn't do much for me.



You're not easily impressed. Here is a list of the most recent AL Triple Crown winners:

1909 - Ty Cobb
1933 - Jimmie Foxx
1934 - Lou Gehrig
1942 - Ted Williams
1947 - Ted Williams
1956 - Mickey Mantle
1966 - Frank Robinson
1967 - Carl Yastrzemski

It goes without saying that all of these players are in the HOF and considered among the greatest the game has seen.
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby baseball77 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:31 pm

Tavish wrote:
baseball77 wrote:
Tavish wrote:Did you look up the WAR for the players this season?



Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.

Did you look up WAR for the players this season?


Haha, touche. The reason I posted that in the first place is because this discussion also took place about a week ago when FraGu's WAR was higher. I assumed since the OP asked this question that this was still the case. Obviously, judging by the voting, other people are still under this impression too.

For the record, MCab's WAR is 2.5 and Gutierrez's is 2.2.
Last edited by baseball77 on Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby GiantsFan14 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:33 pm

baseball77 wrote:
HOOTIE wrote:
baseball77 wrote:Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.


Triple Crown numbers? Unless you are a horse, the triple crown doesn't do much for me.



You're not easily impressed. Here is a list of the most recent AL Triple Crown winners:

1909 - Ty Cobb
1933 - Jimmie Foxx
1934 - Lou Gehrig
1942 - Ted Williams
1947 - Ted Williams
1956 - Mickey Mantle
1966 - Frank Robinson
1967 - Carl Yastrzemski

It goes without saying that all of these players are in the HOF and considered among the greatest the game has seen.


except the triple crown doesn't take defense into account. a ridiculously good fielding centerfielder has a ton more value than a poor fielding first baseman. when you take offense into account it's probably pretty close between the two.
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby Neato Torpedo » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:36 pm

baseball77 wrote:
HOOTIE wrote:
baseball77 wrote:Clearly he did since he stated that in his question. His point, and I think it's very valid, is that people rely solely on one equation to determine a player's value, and when that happens, you get people arguing -- with a straight face -- that Franklin Gutierrez is more valuable than Miguel Cabrera who is currently putting up Triple Crown numbers.


Triple Crown numbers? Unless you are a horse, the triple crown doesn't do much for me.



You're not easily impressed. Here is a list of the most recent AL Triple Crown winners:

1909 - Ty Cobb
1933 - Jimmie Foxx
1934 - Lou Gehrig
1942 - Ted Williams
1947 - Ted Williams
1956 - Mickey Mantle
1966 - Frank Robinson
1967 - Carl Yastrzemski

It goes without saying that all of these players are in the HOF and considered among the greatest the game has seen.

We had a topic a while back where we discussed what a more worthy Triple Crown is, because while HR is a pretty good stat, AVG and especially RBI aren't. AVG is defense-dependent and RBI is mostly team-dependent. I think we came out with something like ISO+OBP+[something].
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Re: Miguel Cabrera VS Franklin Gutierrez

Postby StlSluggers » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:03 am

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