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A-Rod

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Re: A-Rod

Postby Geek » Fri May 07, 2010 12:04 pm

Syfo-Dyas wrote:
Geek wrote:
Syfo-Dyas wrote:What signs?
What expert (real baseball) did you talked to?
Or if you read it somewhere please post a Link.


Other than games played, home runs and RBIs declining two straight years and being off to the worst start in his career this year? And it's only May and he's already having health issues.

To put it another way--there are no signs from 2008-2010 that he is still an elite player. 2007 was the last season he put up elite numbers.

He is 35, showing decreasing productivity and increased injuries, falling over at least one statistical cliff (from 54 HRs in 2007 to 30 last year and on pace to hit 10 this year). Give me David Wright or Longoria over that any day.


He is done as an elite player cause he isnt hitting 50 bombs every year?
Wow.
Or because he wasnt elite in April?
102 ABs 5 HR 11 RBI .235
This was his line in May 2007. Turned out that he wasnt declining.

So you say that 30+ 100+ is elite from Longoria and Wright but not elite from A-Rod in a short season?
I dont see it that way. He must go a full season without reaching 30 HRs 100 RBIs, before I say he is done as elite.

Although age can be a factor with injuries, it doesnt mean that it was a factor in A-Rod's injury.


A-Rod had 19 homeruns at the end of May 2007. He will have to catch fire to have 9 by the end of May 2010.

It takes more than 30/100 to count as elite at 3b, in my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions--I define elite as clearly belonging in the top 2-3 at his position (for SS, 2b, 3b, C--1b and OF are different stories obviously due to the depth at those positions) or at least a 2nd round value.

I'd say there are probably only two elite options at 3b--Longoria and Wright.

After that, you have A-Rod, Zimmermann, Youkilis, and maybe Mark Reynolds (I'm still a skeptic).

A-Rod is still going to be productive, but he's not a superstar performer anymore.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby KCollins1304 » Fri May 07, 2010 12:53 pm

Alex Rodriguez has not hit less than 30 HR since 1997, Wright hit only 10 last year. I don't understand how Wright is clearly a superstar at 3b but that A-Rod isn't anymore according to you.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby jcook3127 » Fri May 07, 2010 2:41 pm

I'm taking Longoria over A-Rod at this point and not looking back....would not accept Arod for Longo in a deal in ANY standard format....redraft or otherwise...

Moving Wright ahead of him, however....not so fast..

The lack of power is concerning me, however....He's had months as bad and even worse than this April was....but now we're 25% done with May..nothing has changed....and it's the fact that he's done this right out of the gates, coming off a steroid scandal and a surgery....he's 35 and that's usually an age power used to die at before sluggers juiced during their age 35 season...

There's just a lot of reasons to be quite skeptical of A-Rod...where as Prince/Teixeira get a pass because we know they're healthy and young...maybe it's unfair...but I'm worried..
Why don't they just get a house that's already painted?
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Re: A-Rod

Postby Syfo-Dyas » Fri May 07, 2010 2:54 pm

Geek wrote:
Syfo-Dyas wrote:
Geek wrote:
Other than games played, home runs and RBIs declining two straight years and being off to the worst start in his career this year? And it's only May and he's already having health issues.

To put it another way--there are no signs from 2008-2010 that he is still an elite player. 2007 was the last season he put up elite numbers.

He is 35, showing decreasing productivity and increased injuries, falling over at least one statistical cliff (from 54 HRs in 2007 to 30 last year and on pace to hit 10 this year). Give me David Wright or Longoria over that any day.


He is done as an elite player cause he isnt hitting 50 bombs every year?
Wow.
Or because he wasnt elite in April?
102 ABs 5 HR 11 RBI .235
This was his line in May 2007. Turned out that he wasnt declining.

So you say that 30+ 100+ is elite from Longoria and Wright but not elite from A-Rod in a short season?
I dont see it that way. He must go a full season without reaching 30 HRs 100 RBIs, before I say he is done as elite.

Although age can be a factor with injuries, it doesnt mean that it was a factor in A-Rod's injury.


A-Rod had 19 homeruns at the end of May 2007. He will have to catch fire to have 9 by the end of May 2010.

It takes more than 30/100 to count as elite at 3b, in my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions--I define elite as clearly belonging in the top 2-3 at his position (for SS, 2b, 3b, C--1b and OF are different stories obviously due to the depth at those positions) or at least a 2nd round value.

I'd say there are probably only two elite options at 3b--Longoria and Wright.

After that, you have A-Rod, Zimmermann, Youkilis, and maybe Mark Reynolds (I'm still a skeptic).

A-Rod is still going to be productive, but he's not a superstar performer anymore.


33/113 in 157 games is superstar but 30/100 in 124 games is not? Just because he was better?
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Re: A-Rod

Postby Geek » Sun May 09, 2010 8:30 pm

Syfo-Dyas wrote:
Geek wrote:
Syfo-Dyas wrote:
He is done as an elite player cause he isnt hitting 50 bombs every year?
Wow.
Or because he wasnt elite in April?
102 ABs 5 HR 11 RBI .235
This was his line in May 2007. Turned out that he wasnt declining.

So you say that 30+ 100+ is elite from Longoria and Wright but not elite from A-Rod in a short season?
I dont see it that way. He must go a full season without reaching 30 HRs 100 RBIs, before I say he is done as elite.

Although age can be a factor with injuries, it doesnt mean that it was a factor in A-Rod's injury.


A-Rod had 19 homeruns at the end of May 2007. He will have to catch fire to have 9 by the end of May 2010.

It takes more than 30/100 to count as elite at 3b, in my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions--I define elite as clearly belonging in the top 2-3 at his position (for SS, 2b, 3b, C--1b and OF are different stories obviously due to the depth at those positions) or at least a 2nd round value.

I'd say there are probably only two elite options at 3b--Longoria and Wright.

After that, you have A-Rod, Zimmermann, Youkilis, and maybe Mark Reynolds (I'm still a skeptic).

A-Rod is still going to be productive, but he's not a superstar performer anymore.


33/113 in 157 games is superstar but 30/100 in 124 games is not? Just because he was better?


Longoria is 25 and in this third full season. He is still improving and is already on his way to outhomering A-Rod in two straight years.

A-Rod is 35, injury prone, and in his third straight year of statistical decline.

The season's over a quarter over, and he has fewer homeruns than John Baker hit in one game.

He has half as many homers as David Ortiz.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby baseball77 » Sun May 09, 2010 8:41 pm

Geek wrote:
Syfo-Dyas wrote:
Geek wrote:
A-Rod had 19 homeruns at the end of May 2007. He will have to catch fire to have 9 by the end of May 2010.

It takes more than 30/100 to count as elite at 3b, in my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions--I define elite as clearly belonging in the top 2-3 at his position (for SS, 2b, 3b, C--1b and OF are different stories obviously due to the depth at those positions) or at least a 2nd round value.

I'd say there are probably only two elite options at 3b--Longoria and Wright.

After that, you have A-Rod, Zimmermann, Youkilis, and maybe Mark Reynolds (I'm still a skeptic).

A-Rod is still going to be productive, but he's not a superstar performer anymore.


33/113 in 157 games is superstar but 30/100 in 124 games is not? Just because he was better?


Longoria is 25 and in this third full season. He is still improving and is already on his way to outhomering A-Rod in two straight years.

A-Rod is 35, injury prone, and in his third straight year of statistical decline.

The season's over a quarter over, and he has fewer homeruns than John Baker hit in one game.

He has half as many homers as David Ortiz.



Not to be too picky, but the season isn't even 1/5th over, let alone "over a quarter".
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Re: A-Rod

Postby urbanbreez » Sun May 09, 2010 8:46 pm

baseball77 wrote:
Geek wrote:
Syfo-Dyas wrote:
33/113 in 157 games is superstar but 30/100 in 124 games is not? Just because he was better?


Longoria is 25 and in this third full season. He is still improving and is already on his way to outhomering A-Rod in two straight years.

A-Rod is 35, injury prone, and in his third straight year of statistical decline.

The season's over a quarter over, and he has fewer homeruns than John Baker hit in one game.

He has half as many homers as David Ortiz.



Not to be too picky, but the season isn't even 1/5th over, let alone "over a quarter".

Thanks for pointing that out so I didn't have to. This guy just throws things against the wall to see what sticks and that's a fine example of it.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby thatguy27 » Sun May 09, 2010 8:58 pm

Montana168 wrote:
Doesn't have the ex-juicer cloud hanging over him (raise your hand if you're certain A-Rod didn't juice in 2005-2007)


Have you seen wright this yr? He came into camp beefed up with enormous arms compared to last yr. Can you say for CERTAIN that he didnt juice in the offseason? no. :-?


Point is, NO ONE can say for certain who did or who did not use steroids other than the player coming out and telling us (unless your barry bonds), yes a-rod used steroids in the past when he was in texas, but that certainly does not mean he was using them when he had his MVP yr with the yanks. for all we know, albert pujols could be on roids. no one can be CERTAIN of anything.

side note, arod will be fine. it is april people. kelly johnson has more homers than arod, teix and pujols. you think that'll be the case in sept? of course not.


I think his point is that ARod has been caught, so he is far less likely to juice again and risk another positive test. Wright may be juicing, but it's pretty much irrelevant unless he gets caught... like ARod did.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby MTUCache » Sun May 09, 2010 11:26 pm

Geek wrote:- It takes more than 30/100 to count as elite at 3b, in my opinion.
- I define elite as clearly belonging in the top 2-3 at his position...
- I'd say there are probably only two elite options at 3b--Longoria and Wright.

After that, you have A-Rod, Zimmermann, Youkilis, and maybe Mark Reynolds (I'm still a skeptic).

A-Rod is still going to be productive, but he's not a superstar performer anymore.


Anybody who wants to point out ARod's faults and the cracks in the armor is more than welcome to. I don't deny he's on the downhill side of his career, but the points you're trying to make here are just silly.

You honestly don't think that ARod is going to hit 30/100, but you have so much more evidence that Wright will?

I'll give you Longo. I agree he's slightly ahead of ARod (in any format), but I think you're just talking out of your azz if you're trying to come up with reasons why ARod isn't elite while other guys are. That's just crazy talk. You can pull out any statistic you want, you can pretend to define any trends you want, but this guy is the definition of "elite". He'll be a first-round pick next year, even if Longo is drafted ahead of him. To try and argue anything otherwise is just trying to be spiteful and incendiary.
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Re: A-Rod

Postby maxer » Tue May 11, 2010 1:27 am

MTUCache wrote:Anybody who wants to point out ARod's faults and the cracks in the armor is more than welcome to. I don't deny he's on the downhill side of his career, but the points you're trying to make here are just silly.

You honestly don't think that ARod is going to hit 30/100, but you have so much more evidence that Wright will?

I'll give you Longo. I agree he's slightly ahead of ARod (in any format), but I think you're just talking out of your azz if you're trying to come up with reasons why ARod isn't elite while other guys are. That's just crazy talk. You can pull out any statistic you want, you can pretend to define any trends you want, but this guy is the definition of "elite". He'll be a first-round pick next year, even if Longo is drafted ahead of him. To try and argue anything otherwise is just trying to be spiteful and incendiary.


well said MTUCache!
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