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Best Pitching Staff 2010

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Best Pitching staff of 2010

Yankees
11
19%
Red Sox
18
31%
Dodgers
0
No votes
Giants
10
17%
Cubs
0
No votes
Phillies
4
7%
Cards
2
3%
Seattle
4
7%
CWS
9
16%
 
Total votes : 58

Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby DaSh 1s » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:23 pm

Oh okay, I see what you are saying. Yes then, I agree. Joba won't have inning limits, so he actually will probably log close to 200 baring injury. The Yankees rotation will definitely provide more innings than the Sox rotation, but I still think the quality of the Sox starters are better.
B-Chad wrote:Pedroia's LD rate of 20% is reason to believe he'll maintain a higher BA then Cano. It should also be noted he hits more FB's then Cano, which means that even if he posts a lower HR/FB then Cano, he should come in reasonably close to Cano in HR's
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby Grounded Polo » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:26 pm

DaSh 1s wrote:Oh okay, I see what you are saying. Yes then, I agree. Joba won't have inning limits, so he actually will probably log close to 200 baring injury. The Yankees rotation will definitely provide more innings than the Sox rotation, but I still think the quality of the Sox starters are better.


I don't know how any reliever could log that many innings.

There's a article in the Daily News today where Eiland basically says Joba sucks as a starter but is great in the bullpen, what role for him makes more sense to you?

Of course, the Joba in the rotation/bullpen is baseball's circus answer to the Favre playing or retiring saga. :-P
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby garf112 » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:50 pm

Most young starting pitchers take time to adapt. I think the Yanks have to give Joba a full season as a starter to see if he can become dominating in that role. If he doesn't, put him back as a reliever. I think they'd be crazy to not let him start this year.
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby Grounded Polo » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:51 pm

garf112 wrote:Most young starting pitchers take time to adapt. I think the Yanks have to give Joba a full season as a starter to see if he can become dominating in that role. If he doesn't, put him back as a reliever. I think they'd be crazy to not let him start this year.


Ditto, I don't get why they refuse to realize that all this jerking back and forth is ruining his future. The Yankees brass can obviously debate privately about Joba's status but they shouldn't be telling the media they want him back in the bullpen. :-t
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby DaSh 1s » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:54 pm

Grounded Polo wrote:I don't know how any reliever could log that many innings.


He pitched a 157 innings last year. He is primed to go 200 this year, if he is effective/healthy. Yank's have been "stretching him out" for the past 2 years.

There's a article in the Daily News today where Eiland basically says Joba sucks as a starter but is great in the bullpen, what role for him makes more sense to you?


I read that article today but its more of speculative article in a time of little NY sport news, more of a filler than anything relevant:

"I think we've all seen the difference in him when he starts and relieves",


"That's who he is. He's got to be an aggressive, come-right-at-you, power-type guy. Sometimes when he started he'd fall behind, he'd try to show all his pitches. Yes, he does have four pitches but he doesn't have to use them in every at-bat."


^Those are the only two quotes the author has by Eiland and completely manipulated them into a Joba is a reliever article. Absolutely nothing from the FO about their goals for him

The Yankees spent three year stretching Joba out to be able to log innings, as I am sure you have seen those stupid "Joba Rules" T shirts floating around NY, that there is absolutely no way they are going to give up hope now.

I have watched Joba compile a 2.76 ERA over 12 GS in 2008, so the talent and ability are definitely there. His season as a starter in 08 ended abruptly with a precautionary DL trip.

Joba had velocity issues last year, and I think it was due to the stupid babying over the years. 2009 they were skipping him, extra days of rest, only pitching two innings at a time, and all this other nonsense. The velocity was a major concern because he would throw his fastballs, and have no idea where they would end up, or what part of the plate they would catch, and it really destroyed his ability to be effective and correctly mix and match. Hence, why Eiland said, when he was behind he would try to flash all his other pitches. It was a absolute mess, when his FB wasn't there.

For 2010, as long as the velocity is back in spring training, I believe he can really lash, out. There will be no stupid inning rules, no skipping, no 5+ days rest and simply will let him pitch. With Phil's innings limit, and the desire by the FO to teach him a CB, the job is Joba's. The main key is his velocity, because he simply isn't a finesse pitcher in the slightest. His success comes from being the power/aggressive pitcher, and when he didn't have the velocity last year, he lost that mind set.

Even if he were in the bullpen it wouldn't have matter because his stuff was still diminished, and he didn't find success at all as a reliever in the pen in 09
Last edited by DaSh 1s on Fri Feb 19, 2010 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
B-Chad wrote:Pedroia's LD rate of 20% is reason to believe he'll maintain a higher BA then Cano. It should also be noted he hits more FB's then Cano, which means that even if he posts a lower HR/FB then Cano, he should come in reasonably close to Cano in HR's
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby garf112 » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:56 pm

GP forgot the ;-7
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby Grounded Polo » Fri Feb 19, 2010 5:12 pm

DaSh 1s wrote:
Grounded Polo wrote:I don't know how any reliever could log that many innings.


He pitched a 157 innings last year. He is primed to go 200 this year, if he is effective/healthy. Yank's have been "stretching him out" for the past 2 years.


Yeah, my comment was tongue in cheek.

There's a article in the Daily News today where Eiland basically says Joba sucks as a starter but is great in the bullpen, what role for him makes more sense to you?


For 2010, as long as the velocity is back in spring training, I believe he can really lash, out. There will be no stupid inning rules, no skipping, no 5+ days rest and simply will let him pitch. With Phil's innings limit, and the desire by the FO to teach him a CB, the job is Joba's. The main key is his velocity, because he simply isn't a finesse pitcher in the slightest. His success comes from being the power/aggressive pitcher, and when he didn't have the velocity last year, he lost that mind set.

Even if he were in the bullpen it wouldn't have matter because his stuff was still diminished, and he didn't find success at all as a reliever in the pen in 09[/quote]

I'm a Joba fanboy, I think he has ridiculous upside, he could easily be better than Javy and Burnett starting next year if he's right.

I'm just hoping all this nonsense is behind him.
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby mweir145 » Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:34 pm

NYY>BOS
25
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby thedude » Fri Feb 19, 2010 7:23 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:
DaSh 1s wrote:What you mean "Seriously 8-o ?"

Regardless of how many Innings Matsuzaka pitches, I still think Matsuzaka will pitch them to a low 4 ERA, rather than 4.5+ I don't think Matsuzaka is going to be a high 4 ERA pitcher because he can only log ~150 innings... I don't understand why you are basing your ERA predictions between Clay/Dice K due to workload.


OK, say Matsuzaka throws 100 innings with 4.25 ERA. Now Wakefield or some other below average pitcher is going to have to make up the difference in IP. I don't expect either Buchholz or Matsuzka to make 30 starts. That is how I figure the 4.5+ ERA for the last two rotation spots for the Red Sox.

Every team is going to have around 1458 IP a year. I feel pretty comfortable saying Sabathia, Lester, Vazquez, Beckett, Burnett and Pettitte will throw around 200 IP. I don't have that same confidence in Joba or Hughes but together I think they fill the 5th spot very well. Buchholz and Matsuzaka are both suspect IMO to pitch a full workload for a SP and the backup for both looks like Wakefield to me.


I understand the concept of IP by starting pitchers. But no those innings will not be made by wakefield or other inferior starters. Those IP will go to the bullpen.

Matsuzaka made 29 starts in 2008 and 32 starts in 2007.
Is there a reason to think Buchholz won't make 30 starts, but Hughes will?

Sure those guys could get injured, but that holds true for EVERY pitching staff in MLB. The next pitch Sabathia throws could end his season. Nearly every pitching staff has injuries every year year.

Even if Wakefield makes ten starts his ERA the last 2 years has been 4.13 and 4.58, so it is doubtful he alone would raise the combined era of Buchholz and Matsuzaka to over 4.50.
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Re: Best Pitching Staff 2010

Postby Pogotheostrich » Fri Feb 19, 2010 9:22 pm

thedude wrote:I understand the concept of IP by starting pitchers. But no those innings will not be made by wakefield or other inferior starters. Those IP will go to the bullpen.

Matsuzaka made 29 starts in 2008 and 32 starts in 2007.
Is there a reason to think Buchholz won't make 30 starts, but Hughes will?

Sure those guys could get injured, but that holds true for EVERY pitching staff in MLB. The next pitch Sabathia throws could end his season. Nearly every pitching staff has injuries every year year.

Even if Wakefield makes ten starts his ERA the last 2 years has been 4.13 and 4.58, so it is doubtful he alone would raise the combined era of Buchholz and Matsuzaka to over 4.50.


I don't think Hughes or Buchholz makes 30 starts. I really don't think Matsuzaka makes 30 starts. The difference being the 6th starter on the Yankees is Joba or Hughes depending on who is the 5th starter. The 6th starter on the Red Sox is Wakefield. He isn't going to have a 5.9 % HR/FB ratio again. And knuckleballer or not he is 43 years old and in decline.
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