I think it's amazing that Leo Mazzone...

[kaiser]

...is not working in professional baseball right now. He is a "third banana" on a sports radio morning show in Atlanta.

I know some people claim he was only the beneficiary of working with some of the best arms in the game, but I think the guy was responsible for a great portion of the success of guys like Smoltz, Maddux and Glavine.

Maybe he doesn't want to deal with the travel, schedule, etc. I don't know. But you can't tell me that there are 30 other guys who are better pitching coaches than Mazzone.

Just one man's opinion.

[JTWood]

I haven't looked at this in terrible detail, but I recall hearing that his time with the Orioles was less than inspiring.

[Neato Torpedo]

I think the guy was responsible for a great portion of the success of guys like Smoltz, Maddux and Glavine.

Ah, the Phil Jackson Fallacy. Never gets old.

[kaiser]

Oh, I understand now. Because Phil Jackson was just "lucky" to be the head coach of teams that won the NBA championship,
and then won it again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.

It happens all the time. He just happened to be in the right place at the right time. Ten times.

[Dan Lambskin]

Oh, I understand now. Because Phil Jackson was just "lucky" to be the head coach of teams that won the NBA championship,
and then won it again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.

It happens all the time. He just happened to be in the right place at the right time. Ten times.

having the best player in the history of the game for 6 of them helps (i forgot how he did those 2 years without Jordan ), and then having possibly the most dominant center in the history of the game with another superstar for 3 more helped quite a bit as well

[dillpickle]

Oh, I understand now. Because Phil Jackson was just "lucky" to be the head coach of teams that won the NBA championship,
and then won it again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.
And again.

It happens all the time. He just happened to be in the right place at the right time. Ten times.

having the best player in the history of the game for 6 of them helps (i forgot how he did those 2 years without Jordan ), and then having possibly the most dominant center in the history of the game with another superstar for 3 more helped quite a bit as well

Ummmm...it's the NBA. No coaching is required. Simply roll the ball out and what ever team has the best athletes wins.

[nolanwood]

Back on topic...

Here's an excellent writeup discussing the "Mazzone Effect":

http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/20 ... _eff_1.php

When he left ATL I thought surely he'd have the same results with Baltimore (DCab, etc)... I agree, Kaiser - I find it odd that he's out of the game.

[Pogotheostrich]

Back on topic...

Here's an excellent writeup discussing the "Mazzone Effect":

http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/20 ... _eff_1.php

When he left ATL I thought surely he'd have the same results with Baltimore (DCab, etc)... I agree, Kaiser - I find it odd that he's out of the game.

Doesn't the fact that he couldn't recreate the effect with a different team take something away for the "Mazzone Effect"?

I am pretty surprised he hasn't caught on somewhere as a pitching coach.

[kaiser]

I think you have to take into account that Baltimore only gave him two years and then dumped him. What Mazzone did in Atlanta was built over a much longer period of time. I'm not saying that Mazzone is a pitching God who can trun any staff to gold... but when guys like John Smoltz, Greg Maddux and Tommy Glavine all name you as the person or one of the people primarily responsible for their success, it says something about your "effect" on pitchers.

[Ender]

I don't really think he was in Baltimore long enough to judge him from it. I think he was probably a good pitching coach but I'd imagine he is overrated somewhat as well. Here is the big secret to being a good pitching coach, coach a team that values defense strongly and plays in a pitchers park and preferably in the NL and if you get to be really picky in the NL West~.