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Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby AquaMan2342 » Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:45 pm

Yoda wrote:
AquaMan2342 wrote:Meh. It's so easily accessible. The fact that it's illegal doesn't make it difficult for people to smoke and for nobody to find out.


Accessibility does not negate the negative stigma of smoking pot. Some people simply won't smoke because it is illegal.


Obviously some people won't, but there's also a certain allure to pot because it's illegal. People will try it and continue to smoke it for the same reason.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby mbuser » Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:44 pm

josebach wrote:Didn't we just talk about this? :-?

I personally don't have anything against weed or people that smoke it, but some people asked for arguments against it, so here they are...

1) The biggest argument in favor of legalizing marijuana is revenue, right? Well, who's going to pay $50 an ounce from a store when it's legal (and very easy) to grow and sell yourselves? Even if you don't want to grow your own, people would start growing and selling weed to their friends to make some extra money. On top of that, I can all but guarantee you that the weed private citizens grow is going to be a heck of a lot better than the store bought stuff.

2) If you make it legal, the amount of people smoking it... and yes, including children... would skyrocket. With increased usage, adverse side effects like 2nd hand smoke exposure and people driving under the influence would also skyrocket.

There are some good arguments in favor of legalizing marijuana, but I've not heard one good argument that counters the two arguments against it that I just mentioned. If one is presented now, I'll absolutely be willing to listen and discuss it, but we've had this debate a half dozen times before and it's really just rehashing (no pun intended) the same thing over and over again.

the biggest argument in favor of legalization is that we'd start acting like a rational society and stop arresting and prosecuting people as "drug criminals" for something as harmless as personal use. the revenue generated from the legalization would be an added benefit

there are plenty of studies that suggest that, while use of marijuana would very likely increase if were to be made legal, we would also see a "substitution effect" take place - people would drink less alcohol, for instance, if pot were to be legalized. and while usage would almost certainly spike immediately after legalization, the numbers would normalize. for a "controlled" substance, pot is incredibly easy to obtain - easier than alcohol for most minors - so most people that are more than slightly interested in buying some are very likely to already have that option. the counter to the last part of 2) is that i'm arguing for legalizing responsible use - that means that i fully support continuing to heavily prosecute those who choose to get behind the wheel under the influence of anything

as for the gateway theory, it's bunk. the major flaw in the gateway theories is that they always work backwards in a clear effort to demonize marijauna - as in, asking the meth user if their first time smoking bud came prior to their first time doing meth. since the answer is invariably yes - same with most hard drugs - it's spun to suggest that the meth use should be directly attributed to prior pot use. the fact that is purposely omitted from these "findings" is that the vast majority of pot smokers' "drug use" never goes any further than pot. the other flaw is that the theory stops at pot while going in reverse in an effort to essentially declare pot itself as the reason why people use hard drugs. the status quo = blame and fight the "war" against the drugs themselves and don't worry about trying to actually help/treat the end-user
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby Yoda » Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:36 am

AquaMan2342 wrote:Obviously some people won't, but there's also a certain allure to pot because it's illegal. People will try it and continue to smoke it for the same reason.


I'm willing to bet that the percentage of pot smokers who smoke solely for the fact that it is illegal, is very small.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby AquaMan2342 » Sun Jul 19, 2009 1:50 pm

Yoda wrote:
AquaMan2342 wrote:Obviously some people won't, but there's also a certain allure to pot because it's illegal. People will try it and continue to smoke it for the same reason.


I'm willing to bet that the percentage of pot smokers who smoke solely for the fact that it is illegal, is very small.


I'd be just as willing to bet that the percentage of people who don't smoke pot solely because it's illegal is very small also.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby bigh0rt » Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:38 pm

AquaMan2342 wrote:
Yoda wrote:
AquaMan2342 wrote:Obviously some people won't, but there's also a certain allure to pot because it's illegal. People will try it and continue to smoke it for the same reason.


I'm willing to bet that the percentage of pot smokers who smoke solely for the fact that it is illegal, is very small.


I'd be just as willing to bet that the percentage of people who don't smoke pot solely because it's illegal is very small also.

Not sure if any studies have been done, but I'd wager that the quantity of people who break laws because they are laws is considerably smaller than the quantity of people who don't break laws because they are laws.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby AquaMan2342 » Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:42 pm

bigh0rt wrote:
AquaMan2342 wrote:
Yoda wrote:
I'm willing to bet that the percentage of pot smokers who smoke solely for the fact that it is illegal, is very small.


I'd be just as willing to bet that the percentage of people who don't smoke pot solely because it's illegal is very small also.

Not sure if any studies have been done, but I'd wager that the quantity of people who break laws because they are laws is considerably smaller than the quantity of people who don't break laws because they are laws.


Funny but you get my point.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby The Artful Dodger » Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:46 pm

Well, like a number of you, I've had a bunch of friends who smoke pot, whether in high school, college, or former colleagues of mine, and they smoked primarily for recreational value, in the spirit of hanging out. Sure, there's an allure to smoking pot in being illegal, much in the same way underage drinking carries such allure, but it's surely not the main reason. If it is, then usually there's a social factor in play.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby bigh0rt » Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:47 pm

AquaMan2342 wrote:
bigh0rt wrote:
AquaMan2342 wrote:I'd be just as willing to bet that the percentage of people who don't smoke pot solely because it's illegal is very small also.

Not sure if any studies have been done, but I'd wager that the quantity of people who break laws because they are laws is considerably smaller than the quantity of people who don't break laws because they are laws.


Funny but you get my point.

No, I was being serious for reals. If I had to choose, I'd say of the people who consider doing it, that the majority of people are dissuaded by there being a law than drawn in.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby Yoda » Sun Jul 19, 2009 5:59 pm

I think that if it were legalized then the current generation's use won't be as high as the future generation's.
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Re: Legalizing Marijuana being discussed in CA

Postby Neato Torpedo » Sun Jul 19, 2009 8:36 pm

Aqua, I think the point you're trying to make is not that people say "hey, let's go out and do something illegal! :-) ", it's that the illegality adds to the allure (to borrow your terminology) of smoking weed. It's like college students and drinking, it's fun getting around and/or fighting the law. It makes people feel rebellious. It's rarely, if ever, the sole reason people start smoking, but it contributes.
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