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Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby thejusman1 » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:13 am

King Tim wrote:Ubaldo's stuff is as good as anyone.

Ubaldo with control = stud
Ubaldo without control = frustrating


+1.

I think what most people are trying to communicate to the OP is that Ubaldo's consistently inconsistent. You never quite know which Ubaldo is taking the mound, and until he finds some consistency, he'll never break that top-tier of pitching and only show glimpses of what could be. Without his control, he walks a ton of guys, gives up a ton of hits, and allows a lot of runs. With control, he's a K machine.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby Bwanna » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:16 am

thejusman1 wrote:
King Tim wrote:Ubaldo's stuff is as good as anyone.

Ubaldo with control = stud
Ubaldo without control = frustrating


+1.

I think what most people are trying to communicate to the OP is that Ubaldo's consistently inconsistent. You never quite know which Ubaldo is taking the mound, and until he finds some consistency, he'll never break that top-tier of pitching and only show glimpses of what could be. Without his control, he walks a ton of guys, gives up a ton of hits, and allows a lot of runs. With control, he's a K machine.


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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby Bwanna » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:18 am

acsguitar wrote:Whatever...all 3 games were in a row so you guys are stupid faces

Ouch! ;D :-b
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby acsguitar » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:33 am

Well the point is he's 25 years old has nasty stuff and other then a string of EARLY season starts he's been fantastic.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby Neato Torpedo » Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:53 am

Field wrote:
oddmanout7 wrote:Throws a 95mph fastball with some downward action, a 85mph slider, a 85mph change and a 75mph curveball. He has a good assortment of pitches and coupled with his improving control, he is a guy I really like for the future. A lot of fantasy players still avoid COL pitchers like the plague, but with a low HR/9 and his gb tendencies, Ubaldo has skills that play well in that park. I've been waiting for a breakout for a few years, and perhaps he has finally started to turn a corner.


Sounds a lot like Carmona :-o , hopefully Ubaldo will continue to progress...

Carmona is a two pitch pitcher nowadays, since he's phased out his slider and sinker. Ubaldo mixes his pitches.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby oddmanout7 » Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:41 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:
Field wrote:
oddmanout7 wrote:Throws a 95mph fastball with some downward action, a 85mph slider, a 85mph change and a 75mph curveball. He has a good assortment of pitches and coupled with his improving control, he is a guy I really like for the future. A lot of fantasy players still avoid COL pitchers like the plague, but with a low HR/9 and his gb tendencies, Ubaldo has skills that play well in that park. I've been waiting for a breakout for a few years, and perhaps he has finally started to turn a corner.


Sounds a lot like Carmona :-o , hopefully Ubaldo will continue to progress...

Carmona is a two pitch pitcher nowadays, since he's phased out his slider and sinker. Ubaldo mixes his pitches.



Carmona Major league career: 9.2(H/9) 0.8(HR/9) 3.9(BB/9) 5.5(K/9)
Carmona Minor league career: 9.1(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 1.7(BB/9) 5.8(K/9)

Ubaldo Major league career: 8.2(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 4.3(BB/9) 7.7(K/9)
Ubaldo Minor league career: 8.0(H/9) 0.7(HR/9) 4.5(BB/9) 8.8(K/9)

So Carmona gives up more hits, HR/9 is close, BB/9 is a difference of .4, and Ubaldo has a large advantage in K/9. In 2009 with 73ip Ubaldo has cut his walk rate to 3.8, while upping his K/9 to 8.1. Carmona, on the other hand, has seen his BB/9 balloon to 5.2 last year and 6.1 this year, while his K/9 has remained a pedestrian 4.3 and 5.3 respectively. As for a comparison of stuff, Carmona throws a sinking fastball around 92-93mph, a change around 86mph, a slider around 84mph and a 2 seam fastball at 91mph. As previously mentioned, Carmona has been phasing out his slider, in favor of a 2 seamer. He has also increased the velocity on his change which reduces the difference in velocity between the change and his fastball. Also, his change has virtually no break.

http://sabrtribe.blogspot.com/2009/05/fausto-carmona-should-we-lose-hope.html

Now Carmona's GB% in the majors is 62%, while Ubaldo's is 52%, although in 2009 Carmona is at 56% and Ubaldo is at 53%. So both pitchers walk a lot of guys, and have GB tendencies (Carmona being superior), but other than that I am not really seeing the comparison here.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby Field » Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:11 pm

oddmanout7 wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:
Field wrote:
Sounds a lot like Carmona :-o , hopefully Ubaldo will continue to progress...

Carmona is a two pitch pitcher nowadays, since he's phased out his slider and sinker. Ubaldo mixes his pitches.



Carmona Major league career: 9.2(H/9) 0.8(HR/9) 3.9(BB/9) 5.5(K/9)
Carmona Minor league career: 9.1(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 1.7(BB/9) 5.8(K/9)

Ubaldo Major league career: 8.2(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 4.3(BB/9) 7.7(K/9)
Ubaldo Minor league career: 8.0(H/9) 0.7(HR/9) 4.5(BB/9) 8.8(K/9)

So Carmona gives up more hits, HR/9 is close, BB/9 is a difference of .4, and Ubaldo has a large advantage in K/9. In 2009 with 73ip Ubaldo has cut his walk rate to 3.8, while upping his K/9 to 8.1. Carmona, on the other hand, has seen his BB/9 balloon to 5.2 last year and 6.1 this year, while his K/9 has remained a pedestrian 4.3 and 5.3 respectively. As for a comparison of stuff, Carmona throws a sinking fastball around 92-93mph, a change around 86mph, a slider around 84mph and a 2 seam fastball at 91mph. As previously mentioned, Carmona has been phasing out his slider, in favor of a 2 seamer. He has also increased the velocity on his change which reduces the difference in velocity between the change and his fastball. Also, his change has virtually no break.

http://sabrtribe.blogspot.com/2009/05/fausto-carmona-should-we-lose-hope.html

Now Carmona's GB% in the majors is 62%, while Ubaldo's is 52%, although in 2009 Carmona is at 56% and Ubaldo is at 53%. So both pitchers walk a lot of guys, and have GB tendencies (Carmona being superior), but other than that I am not really seeing the comparison here.


I was thinking Carmona circa his breakout year when he was featuring something similar to a "..95mph fastball with some downward action, a 85mph slider, a 85mph change", he then reverted back to his control issues which is why I made the comment: I hope Ubaldo continues to progress (unlike Carmona).
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby oddmanout7 » Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:26 pm

Field wrote:
oddmanout7 wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:Carmona is a two pitch pitcher nowadays, since he's phased out his slider and sinker. Ubaldo mixes his pitches.



Carmona Major league career: 9.2(H/9) 0.8(HR/9) 3.9(BB/9) 5.5(K/9)
Carmona Minor league career: 9.1(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 1.7(BB/9) 5.8(K/9)

Ubaldo Major league career: 8.2(H/9) 0.6(HR/9) 4.3(BB/9) 7.7(K/9)
Ubaldo Minor league career: 8.0(H/9) 0.7(HR/9) 4.5(BB/9) 8.8(K/9)

So Carmona gives up more hits, HR/9 is close, BB/9 is a difference of .4, and Ubaldo has a large advantage in K/9. In 2009 with 73ip Ubaldo has cut his walk rate to 3.8, while upping his K/9 to 8.1. Carmona, on the other hand, has seen his BB/9 balloon to 5.2 last year and 6.1 this year, while his K/9 has remained a pedestrian 4.3 and 5.3 respectively. As for a comparison of stuff, Carmona throws a sinking fastball around 92-93mph, a change around 86mph, a slider around 84mph and a 2 seam fastball at 91mph. As previously mentioned, Carmona has been phasing out his slider, in favor of a 2 seamer. He has also increased the velocity on his change which reduces the difference in velocity between the change and his fastball. Also, his change has virtually no break.

http://sabrtribe.blogspot.com/2009/05/fausto-carmona-should-we-lose-hope.html

Now Carmona's GB% in the majors is 62%, while Ubaldo's is 52%, although in 2009 Carmona is at 56% and Ubaldo is at 53%. So both pitchers walk a lot of guys, and have GB tendencies (Carmona being superior), but other than that I am not really seeing the comparison here.


I was thinking Carmona circa his breakout year when he was featuring something similar to a "..95mph fastball with some downward action, a 85mph slider, a 85mph change", he then reverted back to his control issues which is why I made the comment: I hope Ubaldo continues to progress (unlike Carmona).


By your wording I took it as you thniking Ubaldo=Carmona in the present. And BTW, Carmona has never averaged a 95mph fastball. He can hit it, but in 2007 he managed 93.7. I know it seems like nitpicking, but a few mph does make a difference.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby Nerfherders » Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:34 pm

It's pretty simple for Ubaldo. His stuff is practically unhittable, so he does well when he doesn't walk people. If he walks more than 3 batters in a game he will probably get shelled. Lately, he's been keeping his walks to a minimum. In April that wasn't the case. I'm pretty certain that he has mostly worked things out, considering that it's been nearly a year now since he 'got it' and has been very good.

It's a shame his team sucks. He should have a winning record.
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Re: Ubaldo minus 3 Starts in April = Amazing

Postby coma » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:22 am

Was no where near his best outing today, but a complete game victory is great nonetheless.
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