First place vs the Economy - Fantasy Baseball Cafe 2014 Fantasy Baseball Cafe
100% Deposit Bonus for Cafe Members!

Return to Baseball Leftovers

First place vs the Economy

Moderator: Baseball Moderators

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby mblax10 » Fri Jun 05, 2009 8:32 pm

garf112 wrote:[they took Everett as their SS because he is highly underrated as a defensive player. Just because he doesn't have great fantasy stats, doesn't mean he won't help them win games.


This is exactly right but many in this thread suck at logic or thinking about baseball outside of the fantasy world. The Tigers did not sign Everett because he was a cheaper option. They signed him because he's the best defensive SS in the game.
mblax10
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor


Posts: 422
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby walkoffblast » Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:31 pm

mblax10 wrote:
garf112 wrote:[they took Everett as their SS because he is highly underrated as a defensive player. Just because he doesn't have great fantasy stats, doesn't mean he won't help them win games.


This is exactly right but many in this thread suck at logic or thinking about baseball outside of the fantasy world. The Tigers did not sign Everett because he was a cheaper option. They signed him because he's the best defensive SS in the game.


Not sure why you continue to go the name calling route. It is entirely unnecessary and is making you look even more foolish than the content of your posts.

Everett is not an underrated defensive player. He is an underrated baseball player because he has great defense. Have you guys even read the posts? No one is saying Everett is a bad player or was a bad signing. All we are saying is it was a cost efficient move yet they did not re-invest the cash elsewhere. Everett is a guy who has had some injury issues in recent years (played 48 games last year and 66 the year before, in fact he has played more than 128 games all of twice in his career). I think the Tigers would be pretty happy to get a 1.8 WAR out of him, for comparison all the guys with 1.8 WAR last year, each with a plus glove, Garret Anderson, Overbay, Fukudome. Here is the point he is a good signing because he is cheap compared to what was paid to guys like those above but his defense does not make him an amazing player, just a decent undervalued one.
walkoffblast
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 518
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby mblax10 » Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:44 am

What where the better options than Everett at SS this season? Orlando Cabrera? Edgar Renteria? Caesar Izturis? No thanks, I'll take Everett over any of them AINEC. You are severely underrating his defense and in turn, overall value. What he's done YTD is irrelevant.

I don't think you've read all the posts either. Other facts people have pointed out this thread you've refused to read:
-Attendance is not a major revenue source in baseball.
-That being said, the 2009 drop in attendance in Detroit was very predictable. In fact, they've probably exceeded estimations.
-Mike Illitch is filthy rich.
-Illitch doesn't care about how much it costs when he decides he wants to win. See the Red Wings.

I don't give a [mod edit] if you think I look foolish. Your entire thread and failure to think logically are foolish and I'm done with it.
Last edited by kimchi_chigae on Sat Jun 06, 2009 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: minor language edit
mblax10
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor


Posts: 422
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby walkoffblast » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:23 am

mblax10 wrote:What where the better options than Everett at SS this season? Orlando Cabrera? Edgar Renteria? Caesar Izturis? No thanks, I'll take Everett over any of them AINEC. You are severely underrating his defense and in turn, overall value. What he's done YTD is irrelevant.

I don't think you've read all the posts either. Other facts people have pointed out this thread you've refused to read:
-Attendance is not a major revenue source in baseball.
-That being said, the 2009 drop in attendance in Detroit was very predictable. In fact, they've probably exceeded estimations.
-Mike Illitch is filthy rich.
-Illitch doesn't care about how much it costs when he decides he wants to win. See the Red Wings.

I don't give a [mod edit] if you think I look foolish. Your entire thread and failure to think logically are foolish and I'm done with it.


I assume "think logically" means agree with what you are saying even though your "evidence' is random generalities that support your opinion. I am not sure how it is possible to severely underrate someones defense when I called it great. What he has done YTD is irrelevant for the most part, it definitely proves nothing about his overall defensive ability. However, it should be at least somewhat relevant to your odd assertion Everett was the biggest reason for the Tigers pitching staff doing well. Which is what I originally posted it about. Most people who are done with something do not make a post. Seems to kind of defeat the point when you type it in.

I did not ignore the things you list in fact I directly responded to most of them. But lets address some myths:

mblax10 wrote:-Attendance is not a major revenue source in baseball.


That is extremely false.

mblax10 wrote:-That being said, the 2009 drop in attendance in Detroit was very predictable. In fact, they've probably exceeded estimations.


I love how you guys think you proved that. When again did it become true that teams three years removed from the world series had their attendance drop significantly more than 20 percent?

mblax10 wrote:-Mike Illitch is filthy rich.
-Illitch doesn't care about how much it costs when he decides he wants to win. See the Red Wings.


Then why did he cut payroll significantly going into the year? I guess he does not want the TIgers to win. All owners are rich and did not get that way by being stupid. Even the ones that want to win have limits.
walkoffblast
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 518
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby Bobbleheadrusty » Sun Jun 07, 2009 8:28 am

In 2008 gate receipts (including season tickets, club seats) were $75 million. Before the season they had already guaranteed about $40 million in gate receipt due to season ticket holders. Even if total attendance and ticket sales drop 20% at the end of the year you are talking about a loss of $15 million, a non-insignificant number, but not a death blow. Especially when you consider that not all of that is rev.

As for cutting salary, almost every team in baseball did so this season. Even the Yankees, who went out and signed the top three free agents on the market, reduced payroll. Assuming they don't have any big midseason trades, they will have reduced salary about 10% from last season.
Bobbleheadrusty
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor


Posts: 410
Joined: 31 Mar 2008
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby walkoffblast » Sun Jun 07, 2009 10:37 am

Bobbleheadrusty wrote:In 2008 gate receipts (including season tickets, club seats) were $75 million. Before the season they had already guaranteed about $40 million in gate receipt due to season ticket holders. Even if total attendance and ticket sales drop 20% at the end of the year you are talking about a loss of $15 million, a non-insignificant number, but not a death blow. Especially when you consider that not all of that is rev.

As for cutting salary, almost every team in baseball did so this season. Even the Yankees, who went out and signed the top three free agents on the market, reduced payroll. Assuming they don't have any big midseason trades, they will have reduced salary about 10% from last season.


Actually technically speaking 16 teams raised payroll and 14 cut payroll. But I do agree with most of what you are saying. The loss we are talking about only from tickets is clearly not a death blow but it is also not insignificant. But tickets is not the only area of revenue that is decreasing, which is why some teams were lowering payroll in the first place. This thread was never a the first place tigers are going to have to trade Cabrera thread. It was merely a musing on if we could see a first place team have to move a non-superstar but somewhat useful piece because it was too expensive. My guess is that will not happen because I doubt this is much different than the Tigers expected (for economic reasons) but these people saying they are going to spend money at the deadline just because they have a rich owner are cracking me up.
walkoffblast
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 518
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby mblax10 » Tue Jun 16, 2009 7:49 pm

Ilitch has a first-place baseball team, and he said he would do whatever was necessary to ensure the Tigers remained in first place -- even if that meant adding more to an already inflated payroll.


Wow, who would've thought in these tough economic times a multi-billionaire like Mike Illitch who only cares about winning is willing to add payroll? Good thread buddy.

http://www.freep.com/article/20090616/COL08/906160312/1050/SPORTS02/Thrilled+by+Wings++Mike+Ilitch+hopes+to+help+pennant+push+next
mblax10
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor


Posts: 422
Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby walkoffblast » Wed Jun 17, 2009 12:13 am

mblax10 wrote:
Ilitch has a first-place baseball team, and he said he would do whatever was necessary to ensure the Tigers remained in first place -- even if that meant adding more to an already inflated payroll.


Wow, who would've thought in these tough economic times a multi-billionaire like Mike Illitch who only cares about winning is willing to add payroll? Good thread buddy.

http://www.freep.com/article/20090616/COL08/906160312/1050/SPORTS02/Thrilled+by+Wings++Mike+Ilitch+hopes+to+help+pennant+push+next


What he actually said sounds a little different than what the author implied.

Illitch wrote:We're going to do whatever we've got to do," Ilitch said. "We're three games in first. What are we going to do? There are a lot of things that we can do. We're going to try to improve one way or the other.


No one ever said a small addition was going to break them, it would obviously be smart to make a small move if you thought it had a high chance of keeping you in first. The point is it could very well be a dangerous gamble, how much you can take on vs what happens if you miss out on those playoff bucks.
walkoffblast
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 518
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby walkoffblast » Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:43 pm

And right on cue they make a money related move ...
walkoffblast
Minor League Mentor
Minor League Mentor

User avatar

Posts: 518
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Home Cafe: Baseball

Re: First place vs the Economy

Postby mtxdevil » Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:55 pm

walkoffblast wrote:And right on cue they make a money related move ...


And what would that be?
mtxdevil
Major League Manager
Major League Manager

User avatar

Posts: 1095
Joined: 8 Dec 2005
Home Cafe: Baseball

PreviousNext

Return to Baseball Leftovers

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests

Forums Articles & Tips Sleepers Rankings Leagues


Today's Games
Friday, Oct. 24
(All times are EST, weather icons show forecast for game time)

Kansas City at San Francisco
(8:07 pm)

  • Fantasy Baseball
  • Article Submissions
  • Privacy Statement
  • Site Survey 
  • Contact