Fantasy Baseball Cafe Forums

by **mweir145** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 6:32 pm

Bloody Sox wrote:Just as you have a history of misquoting/mis-characterizing things. For at least the fifth time, I said that some blogger brought up the idea that Manny MIGHT have struck out on purpose in that particular instance, and I defended the idea that it was POSSIBLE. Given the 300 or so whacky things Manny did in his tenure in Boston and the fact that he refused to pinch hit on multiple occasions and that this event was in the middle of one of his shoot-his-way-out-of-town episodes, I do believe that it is POSSIBLE. Not definite, not absolute, not certainty - but possible. That you think it is IMPOSSIBLE in the face of all other evidence of Manny's buffoonery is what is ridiculous.

No, what you said was that there was a "very good chance that Manny did," which I still find humourous to the extreme. Read the thread yourself: viewtopic.php?t=357446&hilit=manny+ramirez+strike+out&start=40

Purposely striking out and tanking a baseball game is not on the same level as his other antics, and the only reason somebody even made this ridiculous claim was because of the ill will between the parties at that time. Boston needed another reason to say Manny brought his trade on himself and further drive him away from the fans.

Manny has struck out on 3 pitches many times in his career, and many times against pitchers worse than Mariano Rivera. Why wasn't this just another case of him being fooled by good pitching (which, I should add, is what it looked like to any unbiased person watching the play)? We already know the answer to that, though, it's because you want to believe something foul was occurring. Despite the fact that there is no good reason to believe such a thing (and no reason not to give him the benefit of the doubt), it furthers the agenda that Manny had to go to save the Sox.

by **The Mighty Men** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 2:36 pm

I have a crazy idea. How about you two argue somewhere else about what he said about Manny striking out.

Like anybody else gives a rat's ass.

by **FouLLine** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 4:13 pm

mweir145 wrote:
Bloody Sox wrote:
mweir145 wrote:I couldn't say, but that reminds me of another Torre move that didn't make any sense: http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/mlb/boxscore ... =261007106

Yeah, good point... Arod was so bad at that point he shouldn't have been in the lineup.

What!?

ARod had a .914 OPS in 2006, which ranked 3rd on the team behind Giambi and Abreu. Sure he was 1 for 11 in the first 3 games of that series, but you can't honestly believe that was a legitimate reason to move one of the greatest hitters of all time to 8th in the order? Right?

If I remember correctly this was a playoff game. ARod was hitting terrible in the playoffs. Sometimes when things aren't going as planned or conventionally you have to do some things that are not conventional. That is baseball.

Why question the manager with the best record in baseball?... Especially when he is missing his best hitter.

by **mweir145** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:37 pm

FouLLine wrote:
mweir145 wrote:
Bloody Sox wrote:Yeah, good point... Arod was so bad at that point he shouldn't have been in the lineup.

What!?

ARod had a .914 OPS in 2006, which ranked 3rd on the team behind Giambi and Abreu. Sure he was 1 for 11 in the first 3 games of that series, but you can't honestly believe that was a legitimate reason to move one of the greatest hitters of all time to 8th in the order? Right?

If I remember correctly this was a playoff game. ARod was hitting terrible in the playoffs. Sometimes when things aren't going as planned or conventionally you have to do some things that are not conventional. That is baseball.

Why question the manager with the best record in baseball?... Especially when he is missing his best hitter.

I'll question any manager in baseball if I feel he's made the wrong move. And putting one of the greatest hitters ever in the 8th spot based on a sample size of 3 games is exactly that.

by **Saltydog** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:05 pm

It must be tough to have the luxury of running away with the NL West.

Torre can do whatever he wants, and when Manny comes back it'll be like Christmas for that team.

The rest of that division is in such shoddy shape, it allows Torre to tinker with the lineup any way he wishes.

by **SpecialFNK** » Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:33 pm

if Kemp is going to continue to hit 8th then the K's should come down? because pitchers arnt going to be giving him anything to hit anyway instead just pitching around him to get to the pitcher. the only way Kemp should continue to strike out is if hes swinging at pitches out of the zone, but maybe thats why Torre wants Kemp 8 right now, to learn to lay off pitches that are not strikes? i havnt been keeping track of how long Kemp has been hitting 8th, but in his last 10 games he only has 3 walks and 7 K. i would think a hitter like Kemp hitting 8th infront of the pitcher should have more than just 3 walks.

i also dont see K's really being a big problem for someone hitting in the leadoff spot. i would think the number one most important thing for the leadoff spot is OBP.
another thing managers seem to like for someone in the leadoff spot especially to start the game is to see a good number of pitches. if someone is striking out you have to figure they are seeing a good number of pitches.