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Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby jake_twothousandfive » Sun Mar 15, 2009 2:11 pm

Yoda wrote:
jake_twothousandfive wrote:
Yoda wrote:
So is Werth.

For the cost, I'd much rather have Dukes.

Relative cost adds another dimension to this question. The creator of this thread was asking about dropping Werth for Dukes. Since he already has Werth IMO he'd be better off staying put.

But I agree that Dukes is coming at good value in almost all drafts.


I purposely ignored that part since this is the wrong forum to be asking that question. :-D

Good point. That's definitely true :-b
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby bigken117 » Sun Mar 15, 2009 4:26 pm

PECOTA has them pretty much dead even, but given Werth has a MDP of more than 100 spots higher, I will be waiting on Dukes at the end of my drafts.
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby smoovethug » Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:18 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:
Yoda wrote:For the cost, I'd much rather have Dukes.

Exactly. I've seen Werth go as early as 10th (ECL)


By me. I needed speed there and have no problem taking Werth in the 10th. I like him over Dukes although they should go around the same area. Dukes has more potential but I believe Werth is the safer pick. I said this in the thread that San D mentioned:

I understand that Werth has dealt with injuries in his past but getting him 5-6 rounds later than Corey Hart is an absolute gift. I won't say that I can see Werth going 30/30 but I will say that a 20/20 year is in the bag. I've said this in his thread in the 09 predictions forum: not only does he have good speed but he's smart on the bases, evidenced by his career sb% of 89.7 (44 sb in 49 attempts). Couple this with the fact that he's a pupil of Davey Lopes, who led the Phils to a ML record in sb efficiency (87%, 138/157) in 07, and I can't see how he fails to steal 20 barring injury. Manuel has the tendency to ride a hot bat here and there so sure Jenkins will see some time against a few tough RHPs. While everyone sees the fluctuation in BA from LHP to RHP (.303/.255) his OBP remained virtually unaffected (.368/.360). Also understand that Jenkins in the field is a huge downgrade from the athletic ability of Werth. Manuel has stated that he thinks Werth has proven that he's an everyday player. This all leads me to believe that Werth will get the bulk of ABs.
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby smoovethug » Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:23 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:
Yoda wrote:For the cost, I'd much rather have Dukes.

Exactly. I've seen Werth go as early as 10th (ECL) and that is way too early for my taste. Werth's MDP is 140 and Dukes' is 251. I'd rank them close to each other, with Dukes having a slight edge, but there's no way I'm taking Werth anywhere near where he's going.


Dukes usually goes way earlier than his MDP suggests btw. 259 MDP = 23rd. In the ECL he went in the 13th. Are you screaming about that?
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby Field » Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:35 pm

Dukes won't get past the 13-14th round in most competitive leagues. I definitely see the comparisions between the two players, Dukes seems to have a lower floor given his maturity and PT issues. Werth is a fine pick in the 10th round area, although I haven't been targeting him.

The reason Corey Hart goes higher than the other two is that he has produced more consistently and is in the middle of his prime. I'm rather low on Hart, I don't really expect much more than last season.
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby Neato Torpedo » Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:49 pm

smoovethug wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:
Yoda wrote:For the cost, I'd much rather have Dukes.

Exactly. I've seen Werth go as early as 10th (ECL) and that is way too early for my taste. Werth's MDP is 140 and Dukes' is 251. I'd rank them close to each other, with Dukes having a slight edge, but there's no way I'm taking Werth anywhere near where he's going.


Dukes usually goes way earlier than his MDP suggests btw. 259 MDP = 23rd. In the ECL he went in the 13th. Are you screaming about that?

Not as loud, but 13th is early for Dukes too.

Hi, I'm Neato Torpedo, you may remember me from such topics as "Aramis Ramirez vs. Kevin Youkilis" and "Rowand??????????". Today I'll be deriding another breakout season from a 29 year old in "Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes".

What matters less than what we see is what Manuel sees. And if Manuel notices that Werth gets fewer hits against RHP then he's more likely to sit. He knows that Werth has been a platoon player for most of his career, and he's more likely to use him as such. He may be a starter now but he's likely on a tight leash, especially with trusty veterans Stairs and Jenkins backing him up.
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby stumpak » Sun Mar 15, 2009 9:22 pm

Dukes is loaded with all sorts of risks (PT, off-the-field issues) but ultimately I would rather have him than Werth (and in fact I do). I am just not confident in Werth to either a) produce at the same level on a full-time basis as he did as a platoon player and/or b) hold down a full-time job against RHPs.

Dukes is on the cusp of being the overrated flavor of the month, but Werth is already there.
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby Yoda » Sun Mar 29, 2009 9:51 pm

In my 12 team money league this morning 5x5 (OBP instead of AVG), Werth was taken in the 8th round, 95th overall and Dukes was taken in the 19th, 220 overall. Guess who got Dukes?
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby Ender » Sun Mar 29, 2009 9:54 pm

Did I just hear trusty and Jenkins in the same sentence?
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Re: Jayson Werth vs. Elijah Dukes

Postby Scoots#5 » Sun Mar 29, 2009 10:32 pm

Werth for this year i'd say - and maybe even 2010, after that - i'd be all over dukes.
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