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Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby J35J » Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:54 am

Looks like a few are underestimating how good of a hitter Youkilis is. With that said I'm pretty much right in line with Ender. I'm taking Aramis everytime but Youkilis won't be far behind.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Mar 13, 2009 11:38 am

Ender wrote:Rowand switched from an extreme hitters park to an extreme pitchers park and from a great lineup to probably the worst in baseball so again not a great example. Nobody in this thread is expecting Youkilis to hit 29 HRs again either. They just think the R/RBI spike is because of his position in a good lineup. If Youkilis hits 29 HR again I think he'll be more valuable than Aramis, not near him in value. I think he'll hit around 20 and be just under Aramis in value. I also don't see any reason to expect 30 out of Aramis at this point so maybe that is part of it.

Yeah, and if Paul Bako hits 60 HR he'll be more valuable than Ryan Howard. We draft players on expected value, not what they would put up if you turned all their player attributes up and put the game on Rookie mode. Why would you mention upside for a 30 year old player but discount and possibility of upside for a 31 year old?

P.S. AT&T Park has a 100+ park factor, almost exactly the same as Citizen's Bank Park. Take that as you will.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Ender » Fri Mar 13, 2009 11:59 am

You lost me there. My point was that people aren't drafting Youkilis for 29 HRs this year so the fact that it is most likely an outlier isn't a big deal. People aren't expecting him to repeat last year, they are drafting him for 20ish HR. If I honestly thought Youkilis would just repeat last year I'd be drafting him a lot higher than I am.

Youkilis is a good hitter, he gets on base a lot, he's going to be hitting in the heart of a very good lineup, that gives him a lot of value regardless of anything else. I'm buying into the fact that he has 20 HR pop.

Aramis is a good hitter, he's hitting in the heart of a very good lineup. I'm buying into the fact that he has 25-30 HR pop. The difference in value between the two isn't some huge spike.

My 3B depth chart goes Aramis, Jones, Youkilis. I have Youkilis projected 8 hitters later than Aramis with 2 of those hitters being Cs I'm not likely to draft and one being Chipper Jones who I'm only willing to draft if I've taken safe picks up to that point. The ADP sheet I'm using has Youkilis 10 slots later than Aramis. If someone drafts Youkilis over Aramis I don't think they got good value but I'm also not going to be making fun of them in chat either. It won't surprise me even a little bit if Youkilis out earns Aramis this year, I just think the safer money is on Aramis.

I just dont' agree with the Aramis by a mile sentiment. It is Aramis by a small margin in my book.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Yoda » Fri Mar 13, 2009 12:25 pm

Youkilis is a great hitter. I just don't think he will hit for as much power as he did though.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Mar 13, 2009 1:40 pm

I don't expect Youk to be significantly better than Zim this year. I expect both to hit about .290/21/100/85 with Zim chipping in a couple extra steals.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Pogotheostrich » Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:46 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:I don't expect Youk to be significantly better than Zim this year. I expect both to hit about .290/21/100/85 with Zim chipping in a couple extra steals.

I think you are seriously underestimating the R/RBI for Youkilis.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Neato Torpedo » Fri Mar 13, 2009 9:31 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:
Neato Torpedo wrote:I don't expect Youk to be significantly better than Zim this year. I expect both to hit about .290/21/100/85 with Zim chipping in a couple extra steals.

I think you are seriously underestimating the R/RBI for Youkilis.

Minus 8 HR is minus 8 each of R/RBI right there. Take those out of last year's stats and you have 21/106/83. Take down the AVG .015-.020 and with it likely go some R/RBI.
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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Neato Torpedo » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:21 pm

Something tells me it's my actions here that shrunk my friendliness bar for the first time since I joined. :-b
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Rocinante2: lmao

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Re: Aramis Ramirez or Kevin Youkilis ?

Postby Havok1517 » Sat Mar 14, 2009 5:25 pm

Youk is likely more valuable in real baseball when u consider his defense and him being able to play positions very well. Factor in his grit and poise you could see that argument. Though for fantasy purposes, Aram all the way to the bank.
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