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We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby Pogotheostrich » Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:26 pm

mweir145 wrote:Oh, and it looks like Boras got what he wanted in these negotiations. Not a surprise.

I thought Boras wanted 4 yrs, $100 million? :-?
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby mweir145 » Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:49 pm

Pogotheostrich wrote:
mweir145 wrote:Oh, and it looks like Boras got what he wanted in these negotiations. Not a surprise.

I thought Boras wanted 4 yrs, $100 million? :-?

Maybe before the economy collapsed.
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby mweir145 » Wed Mar 04, 2009 7:49 pm

GiantsFan14 wrote:
mweir145 wrote:
KCollins1304 wrote:
It's a two way street though and you could say the Red Sox cost themselves a WS by not picking up Manny's options and keeping him happy.

So glad that didn't happen...can you imagine Papelbon celebrating another WS victory? I can't imagine being able to deal with it, I'd have to stop watching baseball.


but isn't that papelbon celebtrating in your sig??? i don't get it... :-S

:-C
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby AussieDodger » Thu Mar 05, 2009 2:32 am

mweir145 wrote:
GiantsFan14 wrote:
mweir145 wrote:So glad that didn't happen...can you imagine Papelbon celebrating another WS victory? I can't imagine being able to deal with it, I'd have to stop watching baseball.


but isn't that papelbon celebtrating in your sig??? i don't get it... :-S

:-C


:-D

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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby WyldStallyn » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:26 am

Matthias wrote:
hybrid wrote:
Matthias wrote:It also potentially cost Manny another WS ring. Bay is not Manny as a hitter and the Red Sox in the second half were not nearly the team they were in the first. Not to take anything away from the Rays, they had a great season, but if Manny had stayed in Boston, he at least would've had a shot at a third.

Not sure how you can blame the drop off on Bay, the numbers were pretty close and certainly not a big enough difference to be blamed for not winning a ring.

2008 Boston - Manny - .299/.398/.529/.927
2008 Boston - Bay - .293/.370/.527/.897

Because even at those numbers it was as if Manny was dogging it.

Post-ASB (basically post-trade) Manny's #s were:
.388 / .485 / .723 / 1.208

That and Manny is just more of a professional hitter than Bay. It's one of those intangible things.... in the WS against Colorado, there was one game where he started off with a count 0-2 and twice (or three times maybe?) worked it into a walk. And at least one of those were with the bases loaded.

He just adds something to the lineup that is simply not there with Bay. That's why he could have been enough of a difference to win a ring (emphasis on could have).


gotta love intangibles. ;-7

lowell being out and ortiz not being healthy had more to do with the sox losing in the playoffs than not having manny. in the alcs the team era was 4.65, while the rays was 3.81.
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby Matthias » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:40 am

WyldStallyn wrote:
Matthias wrote:Because even at those numbers it was as if Manny was dogging it.

Post-ASB (basically post-trade) Manny's #s were:
.388 / .485 / .723 / 1.208

That and Manny is just more of a professional hitter than Bay. It's one of those intangible things.... in the WS against Colorado, there was one game where he started off with a count 0-2 and twice (or three times maybe?) worked it into a walk. And at least one of those were with the bases loaded.

He just adds something to the lineup that is simply not there with Bay. That's why he could have been enough of a difference to win a ring (emphasis on could have).


gotta love intangibles. ;-7

lowell being out and ortiz not being healthy had more to do with the sox losing in the playoffs than not having manny. in the alcs the team era was 4.65, while the rays was 3.81.

Especially when there's plenty of tangibles to look at as well.

All I'm maintaining is that the Sox had a better chance winning the WS with Manny in their lineup than Jason Bay. I'm not saying that it would have guaranteed them the win; I'm not saying that there weren't other reasons they lost; just that Manny would have given them a better shot.

I don't see that as really so controversial.
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby WyldStallyn » Thu Mar 05, 2009 9:57 am

Matthias wrote:Especially when there's plenty of tangibles to look at as well.

All I'm maintaining is that the Sox had a better chance winning the WS with Manny in their lineup than Jason Bay. I'm not saying that it would have guaranteed them the win; I'm not saying that there weren't other reasons they lost; just that Manny would have given them a better shot.

I don't see that as really so controversial.


im just sick of people saying that the sox would have been better with manny. if i remember correctly, the sox had their highest winning percentages in august and september, with the lowest being in july. what does this mean? whatever you want it to mean.

maybe they wouldve beaten the rays with him. maybe they wouldve missed the playoffs completely. we just dont know. im just tired of people saying one thing or the other which is usually determined by their attitudes toward the red sox.
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby Yoda » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:36 am

Matthias wrote:
hybrid wrote:
Matthias wrote:It also potentially cost Manny another WS ring. Bay is not Manny as a hitter and the Red Sox in the second half were not nearly the team they were in the first. Not to take anything away from the Rays, they had a great season, but if Manny had stayed in Boston, he at least would've had a shot at a third.

Not sure how you can blame the drop off on Bay, the numbers were pretty close and certainly not a big enough difference to be blamed for not winning a ring.

2008 Boston - Manny - .299/.398/.529/.927
2008 Boston - Bay - .293/.370/.527/.897

Because even at those numbers it was as if Manny was dogging it.

Post-ASB (basically post-trade) Manny's #s were:
.388 / .485 / .723 / 1.208

That and Manny is just more of a professional hitter than Bay. It's one of those intangible things.... in the WS against Colorado, there was one game where he started off with a count 0-2 and twice (or three times maybe?) worked it into a walk. And at least one of those were with the bases loaded.

He just adds something to the lineup that is simply not there with Bay. That's why he could have been enough of a difference to win a ring (emphasis on could have).


I still don't buy that Manny was dogging it in Boston. He was in a slump and grumpy, yes but it was blown way out of proportion.
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby Neato Torpedo » Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:47 am

With the original price being brought down so much, anyone else concerned that he might be in a slump and grumpy for LA this year?
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Re: We THOUGHT Manny agreed TO Dodgers latest offer of 2/$45

Postby mweir145 » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:26 pm

Neato Torpedo wrote:With the original price being brought down so much, anyone else concerned that he might be in a slump and grumpy for LA this year?

Last year when he was supposedly "grumpy," he hit .347/.473/.587 in July. As long as he's healthy, he'll hit.
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